Taxes Done!!!!

[rid 05 198]

I think we can all agree our tax system is FUBAR! We pay one CPA who is also a tax attorney to file our schedule C biz to both the state and feds. We pay another to file our personal returns. If you file an EZ or live below the poverty line look up VITA or TCE programs in your area. They will file for you at no charge.

In my ideal world America would abolish income taxes and implement a flat sales tax. That would put folks on a level playing field. I know that is not the popular idea for at least half of America who pay almost nothing into the federal system yet draw all kinds of federal assistance. We need to quit penalizing citizens for earning a living while incentive are given to live in "poverty".

Now you are just talking about just income tax again.. You look at all the taxes and fees people pay. That's why there are brackets for fed. income tax. Look at all the taxes and fees for all the different income groups and you see who pays the most taxes and fees at their income level. And if the defense is, well people should go out and make more money, it only proves they don't have an argument.

[rid 05 198]

I think it matters how such a simple tax would be applied and deep understanding of tax demographics today. for example, no one is taxed on the first 50k of earnings then a flat tax kicks in. I don't have a business or complex investments but I also hear that some of the wealthiest families in the US can legally hide income. Assume those exclusions were now taxed, generating revenue, such that the flat rate did not have to be super high.

Yes a lot of income is not called earned income. That's were high income groups cash in. Most people the income for them is earned income. Make all income earned income. Big money donors will have something to say about that.

[Dixie-Raven]

Yes a lot of income is not called earned income. That's were high income groups cash in. Most people the income for them is earned income. Make all income earned income.

Which ones? You want all these forms taxed? Some already are. Which are the ones the rich are taking advantage of that the normal guy cannot?

Income that is not considered earned income includes:

Interest and dividends
Retirement income
Social Security benefits
Alimony
Unemployment benefits
Child support
Nontaxable employee pay
Investment-type income such as taxable interest, ordinary dividends, and capital gains distributions
Distributions from a trust

[davidsa]

I would have to think of them as depreciating items that are actually appreciating, things like this. Today's stock market makes the point that no gain is real until it is actually realized so paper gains on stocks does not make any sense.

One thing I learned this year is I need not enter any itemizations going forward unless they change tax law. This will save me a great amount of time; about 50% of the effort.

I was able to do my kids taxes in less than 20 minutes each so for them taxes are trivial and a flat rate would not help them be simpler.

[Dixie-Raven]

I would have to think of them as depreciating items that are actually appreciating, things like this. Today's stock market makes the point that no gain is real until it is actually realized so paper gains on stocks does not make any sense.

One thing I learned this year is I need not enter any itemizations going forward unless they change tax law. This will save me a great amount of time; about 50% of the effort.

I was able to do my kids taxes in less than 20 minutes each so for them taxes are trivial and a flat rate would not help them be simpler.

No need to itemize unless your deductions total more than your allowed standard deduction.

[AMSDJS]

I am not being penalized at all, other than having to pay taxes...lol.

We follow what the accountant tells us to do throughout the year and once he completes the calculations, he lets us know how much we will owe or how much of a refund we get based on our personal tax burden since we are an "S" Corp.

We rarely get refunds because of what is mentioned above, why pay them in advance? Our accountant calculates the amount due for both my brother and I based on our individual tax burden and then send them a check, which is bonused out to each of us to pay the thieving pri*ks.

What a ponzi scheme......all to enrich the elite. They have it figured out to take as much as possible. A flat tax would be fair to all, and make sense, but [They] don't want that. It's easier to steal your money with smoke & mirrors.

M

I agree with you and n2ratfishin, but the wealthy will never vote a flat tax because they would lose all their loopholes to avoid paying their "fair share". Which we will all argue and debate over what defines a fair share. And as mentioned by others, I also agree that all income should be included as earned income and taxed at the flat rate. Very simplistically, let's say there was a 10% flat tax each year on all income besides payroll earnings. The family making say $50K is taxed $5,000 leaving $45K net. The family making $1M is taxed $100K (20x more), leaving $900K net. Of course this sounds absurd to pay $100K in taxes but the family still has $900K disposable income (20x more) than the other family. Now I am in no way a socialist as I have the same disdain for the IRS and government waste. Just trying to say that the tax system is indeed rigged for the wealthy (top 5%) to pay less than a fair share compared to their fellow Americans.

That said, the better way to get rid of govt waste and improve efficiency, is not to fire people actually working. Get rid off all welfare handouts and crack down on unemployment compensation. There are plenty of jobs to be filled in this country. If one chooses not to work, then no free money. Go after the freeloaders first.

[basshammerwannabe]

how many people are truthful with their w-4.. hell i dont even remember filling mine out definitely dont remember ever making changes to it.. but i could of just forgot

[tajchauvin]

He is saying he did not have to enclose a check with his tax return. His tax withholding was more than enough, since he is getting a refund.

Ok. Just getting clarification that he paid taxes even with a refund check.

[basshammerwannabe]

and hows it work with how your employer has your w-4 registered with the irs vs how you fill out your taxes?

[davidsa]

The family making say $50K is taxed $5,000 leaving $45K net. The family making $1M is taxed $100K (20x more), leaving $900K net. Of course this sounds absurd to pay $100K in taxes but the family still has $900K disposable income (20x more) than the other family.

I would think many elite earning households would love a flat tax. Assume you make $1million in income, dividends and profit from asset sell. Very little to no way to hide this. The family making $1M in income from such forms will pay about $280K in federal tax for 2024 and that is with the 2016 tax cuts in place. The flat tax of 100K would be a massive benefit to this group. I'm sure they would argue that it gets them closer to fair share

[LateralLine]

No need to itemize unless your deductions total more than your allowed standard deduction.

Not sure how many could itemize at $14,600 Single & $21,900 Married

[Bueller]

I agree with you and n2ratfishin, but the wealthy will never vote a flat tax because they would lose all their loopholes to avoid paying their "fair share". Which we will all argue and debate over what defines a fair share. And as mentioned by others, I also agree that all income should be included as earned income and taxed at the flat rate. Very simplistically, let's say there was a 10% flat tax each year on all income besides payroll earnings. The family making say $50K is taxed $5,000 leaving $45K net. The family making $1M is taxed $100K (20x more), leaving $900K net. Of course this sounds absurd to pay $100K in taxes but the family still has $900K disposable income (20x more) than the other family. Now I am in no way a socialist as I have the same disdain for the IRS and government waste. Just trying to say that the tax system is indeed rigged for the wealthy (top 5%) to pay less than a fair share compared to their fellow Americans.

That said, the better way to get rid of govt waste and improve efficiency, is not to fire people actually working. Get rid off all welfare handouts and crack down on unemployment compensation. There are plenty of jobs to be filled in this country. If one chooses not to work, then no free money. Go after the freeloaders first.

You might be surprised to learn that a $1 million income falls in to the 28% tax bracket and will owe $280,000 in Federal taxes.

[dean c]

Tax brackets are graduated. You end up with an effective tax rate. As far as refunds…y’all just keep em
coming if it makes you happy.

[davidsa]

You might be surprised to learn that a $1 million income falls in to the 28% tax bracket and will owe $280,000 in Federal taxes.

actually it is in the 37% bracket but the weighted average or effective tax rate is 28%.

by contrast someone married filing jointly making 50k pays about 5% effective federal tax rate.

[Okie Poke]

I always wait as long as possible. I always have to pay.

^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^

[AMSDJS]

You might be surprised to learn that a $1 million income falls in to the 28% tax bracket and will owe $280,000 in Federal taxes.

I am aware of this but I guarantee they or their accountant will easily figure out mechanisms to reduce their actual taxes they pay for the year.

[ProVle]

I am aware of this but I guarantee they or their accountant will easily figure out mechanisms to reduce their actual taxes they pay for the year.

Is there a problem with that? It works for everyone the same way.

[Bueller]

I am aware of this but I guarantee they or their accountant will easily figure out mechanisms to reduce their actual taxes they pay for the year.

CPA may get to down to 20% which is, you know, $200,000. And it’s far from easy.

[AMSDJS]

Again, I was using a simplified example for the flat rate on income but mostly highlighting that total net wealth should be included as income. One actual (not hypothetical like mine was) example is Amazon’s Bezos. His net wealth increased by some 100+ billion back during the mid 2010’s (forget the years but you can Google it). But he claimed income of some 5-6 billion and paid just over a billion in taxes. Something like 1.1%. So in this real world case, the uber rich are not paying their fair share, even though the tax laws are written such that it’s not illegal yet be serious, is he really hurting if his net wealth is hit by 10 billion vs. 1 billion? As if anyone can fathom needing that amount (9 billion) in a lifetime? I’m not saying he’s not smart or doing anything wrong, just that our tax system is skewed so the uber rich (e.g., those owning multiple commercial real estate, etc) don’t pay in what one might believe they do.

[ThomasD]

Again, I was using a simplified example for the flat rate on income but mostly highlighting that total net wealth should be included as income. One actual (not hypothetical like mine was) example is Amazon’s Bezos. His net wealth increased by some 100+ billion back during the mid 2010’s (forget the years but you can Google it). But he claimed income of some 5-6 billion and paid just over a billion in taxes. Something like 1.1%. So in this real world case, the uber rich are not paying their fair share, even though the tax laws are written such that it’s not illegal yet be serious, is he really hurting if his net wealth is hit by 10 billion vs. 1 billion? As if anyone can fathom needing that amount (9 billion) in a lifetime? I’m not saying he’s not smart or doing anything wrong, just that our tax system is skewed so the uber rich (e.g., those owning multiple commercial real estate, etc) don’t pay in what one might believe they do.

Income and wealth are two completely different things. Start taxing peoples wealth and eventually nobody will be wealthy