tilt/trim service

[86 inches]

All of my trim/tilt cylinders are leaking. If I fill the res with fluid it will work but they leak from around the rods and eventually run out of fluid. I'm thinking about tackling this job myself.

The service manual calls for two end cap removers one for tilt 326485 and one for trim 436710.

It also calls for a cylinder seal protector 326005. I haven't seen that mentioned in any thread here on BBC.

Is there anything else I should order?

If I have to order several hundred dollars worth of tools I would probably be better off having the shop do the service.

And any advice on where to get these tools. I can't find how to look for tools on shopevinrude.com


1994 Johnson venom 225JSTLERK<br /><br />
Modified by 86 inches at 9:21 AM 3/7/2011<br /><br />
Modified by 86 inches at 7:12 AM 4/4/2011


Modified by 86 inches at 7:13 AM 4/4/2011

[86 inches]

Hmm.. I think I might take a pass on this one. Can't find the tools.

[ChampioNman]

The tools are listed in your shop manual, you then order them from your dealer. They are pricey though and unless you are going to service trim motors frequently its not worth the cost to you. Sometimes you have to bite the bullet in take them into the pros.

[86 inches]

Once again I'm gonna take your advice. Thanks.

[86 inches]

Fred,

What do you think about me attempting this with...

a universal spanner wrench in place of the OMC Tilt Cylinder End Cap Tool (#326485) and Trim Cylinder End Cap Tool (#436710).

and instead of the OMC Rod Holder Tool (#983213), using a block of wood with an appropriate size hole cut in half and put in a vice.

[86 inches]

Oh... I should add...

When I fill the unit with fluid it seems to lift pretty strong but fluid leaks from around all three rods. This suggests to me that the motor is OK and that the leaks are probably at the end cap scraper seals and/or O rings.

[ChampioNman]

The trim wipers are pretty easy to do, best bet is to crack them while it is on the boat. The tilt ram is one I'd worry about, you can use a spanner on that one. With the motor trimmed all the way up and the trailer bracket deployed, run your finger up and down the back side of the tilt ram and feel for any pitting and gouging. If there is any then you will need to replace the tilt ram. $$$$. The wipers on all of them are all one piece now so you have to replace the caps. To service the tilt ram the unit needs to come out and set in a vice. You will then have to remove the nut for the ram and then the wiper can be removed. Replace the O rings in the plunger while it is open.
Once you are done fill the reservoir while the unit is on the bench. Makes your life much easier.

[86 inches]

Here is a pic of one trim cylinder (the other looks the same). Its hard to see in the pic but there is a trail of fluid leaking down from the rod at the wiper. I marked the trail with a red arrow.




The tilt ram feels smooth... no pitting or gouging...

[ChampioNman]

AZ heat can do it and age. Not uncommon.

[86 inches]

Well... I haven't decided if I'm going to try this or leave it for the mechanic. In days past, I would've been happy to pay the pro. But I've been trying to do as much as I can this time around... I don't know why. I don't think I've saved much money so far... what with buying tools and fluids,greases, sealers... and doing some jobs 2 or 3 times! I certainly haven't saved any time!

Still... when I look at the service manual, it just doesn't look that tough... and then I think... shoot! I should just do this myself! Famous last words... right?




Modified by 86 inches at 7:20 AM 4/4/2011

[86 inches]

I called shopevinrude this morning and they assured me that the O-ring and seal kit was available for my fasttrack and that it included the scraper seals for the tilt and trim cylinders. Hopefully, I'll be able to pull it all apart, replace all of the seals and O-rings and get it back together so that it works. Still need to find a spanner for those trim cylinders.

This is going to be an adventure...

$68 for the seal kit
$24 to replace the thrust pads (one is missing)
$52 for a universal spanner wrench

If I can do it for that, I'll be happy. I hope there are no surprises waiting around the corner


Modified by 86 inches at 8:34 AM 3/28/2011

[86 inches]

Received seal and o-ring kit today:

Pic 1 and Pic 2: Tilt scraper.





Pic 3: Trim scraper. There are two of these in the kit.



Pic 4: From left to right, two trim scrapers and two, what the service manual refers to as inner quad rings.






Modified by 86 inches at 7:17 AM 4/4/2011

[86 inches]

This would be a beautiful thing...




... if it wasn't for this



Everything looks good and I have all the right parts... just can't crack that one cylinder endcap. I'm gonna have to take it somewhere for a little help.

[ChampioNman]

That's why they have the special tool. It is a socket type wrench that fits all four holes. Your local BRP shop should be able to help you right out.

[86 inches]

Took the unit to the shop yesterday morning. In the time it took for me to pull two tubes of hydraulic fluid off the shelf they had the end cap off! Right tool for the job. No charge.

Reassembled the unit with all new seals and O-rings. Went back together very nicely. Filled the unit with fluid and then reinstalled it on the motor. Went through the bleed procedure that is documented here in several other posts but just couldn't get the air out. Trim cylinders are strong but the tilt won't lift at all. I can hear air gurgling around in there especially when I release the manual release valve to do the bleed procedure. Every time I lift it up onto the trailer or service bracket and crack the reservoir cap, I get a slight release of air but then fluid starts to drain. I can't get the air out and I can't add more fluid! Very frustrating.

The new seals look like they are holding perfectly and at one point I had the tilt cylinder pushing pretty strong but I can't get the air out and now the tilt won't lift at all.

The motor sounds fine, BTW.

I can't imagine that the unit is bad. Before I pulled it it would work fine except for the massive leak at all three rod seals. The only questions I had during the assembly were; my buddy oriented the tilt piston assembly for the placement of the balls, plungers and springs as I read the directions from the manual and I didn't double check the orientation. But he's plenty sharp and I have no reason to believe that he would've got it wrong... I just didn't see it with my own eyes.

The second odd thing was that my manual release valve differed from the one in the manual. Mine had different positions for the O-rings and no groove for split rings. I replaced the O-rings that were there and it seems to work and it doesn't leak. But maybe that was the problem and I should order a new valve.

Dang it! I was so close to fixing this myself. Not a total failure but not a total success.<br /><br />
Modified by 86 inches at 8:01 AM 4/5/2011<br /><br />
Modified by 86 inches at 8:02 AM 4/5/2011


Modified by 86 inches at 11:25 AM 4/5/2011

[86 inches]

The more I think about the more I think the manual release valve might be the problem... not that I know ANYTHING. But that's the only thing that was suspicious during the reassembly. Everything else just went back together perfectly. The only other thing might be the motor but it was working fine before. Anyway, I ordered a replacement valve.

In the mean time, my buddy is taking my boat over to a friend of his that owns a marine shop here in town and who supposedly services OMC. I just want him to take a look and see if we are just not bleeding it right.

[86 inches]

The guys at the shop bled the unit and had it "sorta" working. But then it quit running up and down. The mechanic noted that it looked like there might be some junk in the fluid when he drained it. He thought it MIGHT be metal. I looked in the pan and there were some tiny gold flakes and the fluid had a very fine black grit or powder in it.

I brought the boat home and pulled the unit of the motor this afternoon, drained it and took it apart. I found the same fine particles that I saw in the fluid at the shop. Oddly, the tilt cylinder filter looked clean and the filter that sits over the valve body was clean.

I was beginning to doubt that there was actually debris in the fluid - it was very fine and hard to see - but then I opened one of the trim cylinders. The split rings that sit on both sides of the O-ring were destroyed! I opened the other cylinder and those splits were fine.

When I rebuilt the unit I replaced the old split rings with the new parts from the kit but they were very difficult to keep tight to the piston and inserting them into the cylinder was hard to do without them being pushed out of position. I decided to use the old ones because they fit much tighter. My buddy who was helping me got his to go using the new ones but I went ahead and slid mine in with the old ones. Mine went in very easily.

Guess which ones were destroyed...

The new ones.

Looking at them closely they are made of a black hard material and when crumbled break down into those tiny black and gold flakes.

So now what is the best approach to salvage this thing?

I'm thinking that I should clean it out the best I can then put it together and run it up and down several times while on the bench and then drain the fluid and do it again till clear.

I'll put up some pics tomorrow. Maybe detailing my error will help prevent somebody else from making the same mistake. Definitely a learning experience.

<br /><br />
Modified by 86 inches at 9:36 PM 4/8/2011


Modified by 86 inches at 5:48 PM 4/10/2011

[86 inches]

Here are the pics...

This is the trim rod with the new split rings on both sides of the o-ring. See how lose they fit.



The openings in the split rings need to be set 180 degrees from one another and then held in position as the rod is slipped into the cylinder. Its a bit tricky because the opening of the cylinder is threaded for the end caps and is a bit wider than the deeper working part of the cylinder. As a result its hard to keep the rings in place with your fingers. They want to spring lose as soon as you lose contact with them and before they slip into the cylinder below the threads. This is the opening of the trim cylinder.



Apparently I did not notice that the rings had slipped out of position during placement. This pic shows the result. On the left are the remains of the split rings that I found when I opened the cylinder. The rings on the right are what they should look like.




This is the trim rod that had the old rings put on. They fit much tighter. That rod was much easier to get in the cylinder.



Here they are side by side and viewed on end. On the left is the trim rod with the old split rings and on the right is the one with the new rings in place.

[86 inches]

Some more pics...

Cylinder filter



Valve body filter



Valve body



Valve body



Core/valve body connection

[86 inches]

Suspicious manual release valve:

This valve does not look like the one in the service manual. The red arrow marks where the service manual shows a plastic ring... not an O-ring.

The green arrow marks where the service manual shows a groove for another plastic ring. These aren't present on the valve that I have.