Need help with a shift cable/control question

[nola 521dvx]

Have a 04 225 HO on a 03 Ranger 521. I had to remove the remote contol to test the start neutral switch and when I got it all back together the remote control handle would now engage in the detents for neutral and forward and would continue forward to the full throttle position (boat has a hot foot, so no throttle cable attached to the remote), but would not go into the full throttle reverse position. Same problem if the cable was removed from the shift linkage at the engine. However, if I remove the cable from the remote, the remote handle now goes from full throttle forward all the way through full throttle reverse. I suspect that this means the shift cable itself is binding somewhere - can the master boat riggers out there confirm or show me the error of my ways? Sorry for the long post, thanks for the help.

[rickdb1]

Did you have someone spinning the prop while you shifted?

[nola 521dvx]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by rickdb1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did you have someone spinning the prop while you shifted? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes - didn't help. Wouldn't move all the way back even with motor running.

[nola 521dvx]

Well maybe I didn't have a problem after all - just called Ranger and they told me the shift handle is only supposed to go halfway back for Evinrude motors. Can anyone out there confirm that - I seem to remember mine going all the way back, and to get the shift lever off I had to remove a set screw that was only accessible with the handle in full reverse? Scratching my head.....

[ChampioNman]

You didn't happen to bump the spline shaft on the control box did you. You may have to take the box back out and line up the indention on the spline and the set screw again. You should have a full range of motion either direction.

[nola 521dvx]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ChampioNman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> You didn't happen to bump the spline shaft on the control box did you. You may have to take the box back out and line up the indention on the spline and the set screw again. You should have a full range of motion either direction. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't think so - I scratched alignment marks on the splined shaft and handle before disassembly so I'd get them back together exactly the same. The guy at Ranger says I should be able to get the set screw in with the shift lever all the way forward, but I tried that yesterday with no success. He also said that only Merc engines have full range of movement back and front - Evinrude and Yamaha go only haff way back. Dunno - he rigs boats day to day but my memory of my boat agrees with what you say.

What do you make of not having a full range of movement even with the cable detacjhed at the engine - to me this means either that there is supposed to be no full range of movement or that the cable is bound up at some point in its travel and needs changing? Thanks for your help.

[ChampioNman]

As much as a pain in the butt that it is I'd remove the handle and verify the alignment. So the Ranger guy says you should only get say 1/8th throttle in reverse if your throttle cable was connected?

[nola 521dvx]

Thanks ChampioNman. I'll pull it apart again (you are correct, it is a huge pain in the butt, seemed like evry time I removed the last screw holding stuff together, there would be another layer to deal with...) - but I checked and double checked and triple checked the alignment marks on the splines and the handle is vertical when the shift control cable attachment is at the middle of its range. The cable just simply runs out of freeplay when the shift lever is moved past half way back.

Anybody reading this who has direct access to a boat with an 04 Evinrude - could you see if your shifter moves all the way back into reverse? My memory agrees with ChampioNman, but Joe the Ranger guy rigs boats for a living at the factory so he has some credibility too! The worse thing about this is that the original reason for tearing into it was a potential issue with the start neutral switch - that turned out to be a red herring, so all of this BS was unnecessary...

Thanks for your help.

[noelm]

I have seen a very similar problem a few times, but not too sure how it could just happen now, there is a very common fault that will allow forward and neutral, or reverse and neutral but not both, no amount of adjusting can fix it, the usual cause is the small plastic gears that move to engage the gears when the lever is moved (not the big round looking one) they just wear a bit and no longer give you the travel you require for forward and reverse, you can adjust for one ot the other, might help you out, but also may just send you on another "look and see" but worth a look at least.

[nola 521dvx]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by noelm &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have seen a very similar problem a few times, but not too sure how it could just happen now, there is a very common fault that will allow forward and neutral, or reverse and neutral but not both, no amount of adjusting can fix it, the usual cause is the small plastic gears that move to engage the gears when the lever is moved (not the big round looking one) they just wear a bit and no longer give you the travel you require for forward and reverse, you can adjust for one ot the other, might help you out, but also may just send you on another "look and see" but worth a look at least.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks - something else to look at when I get it all apart again. One thing though is that the handle will move through the whole range perfectly when disconnected from the cable, but not when connected - would this fit with the problem you have seen?

[noelm]

just to make sure we are talking about the same thing, you do have the "normal" old control box, not a Binacle or a special side mount? if so, this is what happens, (normaly with throttle on control, not a foot control) there is a big roundish looking part that the throttle connects to, when you move the lever forward it is slotted and connected to it is a pair of gear cogs, the cogs are connected to the gear cable, the wheel to the throttle, it moves in the slot while moving the gear cable to engage gears, until a predetermined point when the cogs no longer are engaged, but the wheel now moves the throttle cable only, very hard to explain, but easy as pie if you look at it, in your case, the wheel bit will be not connected to anything as you have a seperate throttle, it will only move the gear part of it, still unsure how it could just happen, it normaly happens over a period of time.

[nola 521dvx]

Don't know whether I have normal or special side mount, but I actually don't recall seeing any gears in it whatsoever - just a shaft with a pin that engages two recesses in a wheel that itself rides on three cyclindrical "bearings" - the range of motion seems to be determined by the bearings riding in indents in the wheel. I suspect we are talking about different set-ups. Thanks all the same.

[ChampioNman]

Just per chance you didn't happen to install the cable into the wrong linkage? It can happen. And don't be embarrassed if it did happen stuff happens. Nolem I would venture to say it is a concealed side mount.

[noelm]

yep, that's what it sounds like now after the description.

[nola 521dvx]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ChampioNman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Just per chance you didn't happen to install the cable into the wrong linkage? It can happen. And don't be embarrassed if it did happen stuff happens. Nolem I would venture to say it is a concealed side mount. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Wish I could say that was the answer - but I made sure to leave a cotter pin in the relevant linkage when I removed it. And to double check I tried attaching it on the inside and outside of the linkage, and on the throttle linkage too....I make plenty of mistakes believe me but didn't make this one. I'm very puzzled and irritated since all of this was ultimately unnecessary!

Does anyone else have an opinion on whether the shift lever should go all the way back (90 degrees) for reverse - unless there is something wrong with my shift cable itself, there just doesn't seem to be enough extension to go the full 180 degrees?

[Garfish]

Andy, I had an 04 225HO and replaced it a year ago with an 08 250HO. BOTH engines when the starboard mounted shift lever engaged forward it would continue to travel to I'd say 90* from neutral and likewise in reverse it will lay almost 90* back. This is on the 04 and on the 08, precisely the same....G

[nola 521dvx]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Garfish &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Andy, I had an 04 225HO and replaced it a year ago with an 08 250HO. BOTH engines when the starboard mounted shift lever engaged forward it would continue to travel to I'd say 90* from neutral and likewise in reverse it will lay almost 90* back. This is on the 04 and on the 08, precisely the same....G</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks Garfish - that confirms what ChampioNman says and what my gut tells me - guess I'll be tearing into it again. I think I'll try it with another cable, if that doesn't work I'll tear down the shifter itself and see if anything looks out of place. I'm mechanically pretty good but thsi sure has me puzzled. I'll post back if I figure out the problem, maybe it will stop someone else from tearing out their hair.

[Garfish]

I rely on his and Seahorses experience and knowledge a lot, you can't go wrong...............G

[nola 521dvx]

Update - well it took a long time, much head scratching and just a little cussing but I finally got it figured out - and wouldn't you know it it was incredibly simple. While I identified the correct arm and hole on the remote to attach the cable to, turns out I had attached the cable on the outside (curved) surface of the arm - this restricted the movement of the cable by a hairs width, enough the stop engaging the reverse detent. Once the cable was attached to the inside (flat) surface of the arm, I got the full range of motion forward and reverse. I sincerely hope that this helps someone else in the future, this thing almost had me beat!

[ChampioNman]

There ya go! See the Ranger guy was wrong. .