No he wasn't a wild-eye'd basher and I never said he was. He was never all that fazed by where some of his drives ended up because he had an exquisite short game and was arguably the world's best putter as well.Originally Posted by Slicefixer
Perhaps the driver was the most important club in Hogan's day, but it's not today and hasn't been for a very long time. And I think you know that.
2013 Ranger Z520c, 2013 Yamaha 250 SHO
2018 Ranger RT198p, 2013 Mercury 150 Optimax
Sir, respectfully, the driver will ALWAYS be, by far, the most important club in the bag. The driver sets up a players entire game as it's the first shot on most holes (obviously minus par 3's). How well a player positions their drive determines their level of offense vs defense etc. If you drive it out of play more than once a round winning becomes an almost impossible task.
Now, not to put words in your mouth, what I THINK you mean is this, driving the ball today (due to technology) is much, much easier so its importance isn't what it once was..... if that's so then I DO agree with you.
However, don't take that to mean that driving isn't still the genesis of consistently successfully competing at the elite levels..... it is and always will be. But it IS M U C H easier than it once was..... even then it's still not a simple task.... just simpler.
Gary Player is one of the greatest ever. Randy, not so much.
I've been playing golf for most of my life and that dang windmill always gives me problems.
Hi Mike.
You’re absolutely right…equating Gary Players opinion on the state of professional golf to the comments on the marketing derbies of “pro” fishing is pretty ridiculous.
Hell there hitting Gap Wedges over 150!
If professionals who's careers depend on catching fish use FFS then that's what I'm using. Might be too simple of a philosophy but makes sense to me.
Taking a little out of the ball won't hurt the Pro's. There's only 3 things that bother a good player- Tall grass just off the fairway, heavy rough around the greens, and wind. The tour can control the first two. Just look at the British Open in a wet year. Grass waist high 20 feet off the fairway. Conditions like that shows who is controlling their ball the best.
You're 100% dead on correct.....
Although, there will be an affect to some degree as the ball will not only be a bit shorter, but, slightly harder to control....bad shots a bit further off line. The truly great ballstrikers will have a bit more of an advantage in theory.
I'm truly curious to see where all of this goes.....
My son is/was a really good player....D1 full, etc. I sent him back to school with a set of Hogan PC blades with X100's tipped..... MacGregor M85 persimmon driver shaved to 8° of loft also tipped X1....a MacGregor 4 wood set up the same.....v grooved wedges....and a '64 8802.... plus a few balata balls. They played one of the very best major championship courses in the world about once a week. I told him to take that bag and go play it. He and his teammates did for 9 holes. My son was the only one to break 40 with a couple in the mid 40's. It was a much more demanding game with that equipment. The Player's and Nicklaus types have a very valid point.... and as mentioned up above, to lump them in with Randy Blauket is, well, a bit of a joke. ..(no offense to Mr Blauket as he's a fine fisherman)
Again, I am NOT in favor of going back to the stuff I grew up playing and played through college and for most of my years as a professional. They just need to get things back more under control.
I have the same feelings about FFS.... just needs to be some form of compromise reached. Banning isn't the correct approach IMOP. Plus I own and use AT1 and detest hypocrites....
The truth is the truth, regardless of who's lips it passes over when speaking it. Too many sycophants just "me too" and vacillate on opinions they claim based on their "hero of the day". People need to look at the principles of the subject matter and make up their own mind, regardless of who speaks to things one way or another. To just go along with the crowd or some popular dude of the day is high school level clique-think.
They were hitting 46* 9 irons 150 yards back in the 80’s. GW’s are mostly 50* and the same length as a 9 iron.
Back when Gary Player was competing drivers were 43-44.5” long. Today they are 46.5”.
Harvey Penick in his book stated, The woods are full of long drivers.
To be able to add another to your list, I think sand traps need to be made more of a trap than just another playing surface (at least for the pros). Either reshape them to be more like the kettles across the pond or leave them looking pitted and rutted as though a herd of cattle has been through. These perfectly raked and manicured traps are too easy for pros and should be more of a punishment for making an errant shot
Some people are so judgemental. You can tell just by looking at 'em.--Some random meme
Hehehe.... you should have stood in the ones at Hoylake last summer..... dead flat with a sheer face..... you hit it in a bunker you were holding your breath and praying the ball got somewhere near the center of the bunker....
Man does this bring back memories. I played in highschool with powerbilt citation blades and the same Powerbilt persimmon driver. That was decent stuff in those days…and a dozen tour titlest balatas. Shank one of those and you might as well throw it away!
Hehehe..... man Dean, you could cut a balata by just THINKING about thinning it.... heheheMan does this bring back memories. I played in highschool with powerbilt citation blades and the same Powerbilt persimmon driver. That was decent stuff in those days…and a dozen tour titlest balatas. Shank one of those and you might as well throw it away!
PB Citations were really good irons (really good company).... really good. My father was great, great friends with Miller Barber. Miller played H&B for his entire career, in fact a Miller hand me down Citation 1 iron was in his orange hand me down PB staff bag the day he passed away... still have it. So a bunch of memories are flooding my way due to your post.....
I see you're in Humble, does Atascocita CC still exist? We qualified our there all the time in college and it was my favorite course. Of course that was 4 decades ago.... hehe
The last time we went visit my brother in law in Kingwood it was still there. Looks like a goat ranch though.
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$8
Yes sir…Atascocita CC is still around and operating as a daily greens fee course. It’s gone through some ownership changes and even a shutdown for a while. It’s back in pretty good condition. I have some buddy’s play out there often. I intend to get back at it in the near future. You can bet this old man will take advantage of all the technology!
Diadema in N Anson, ME has 1-2 kettles. I had the misfortune of landing in one. One look at the face of that thing and I decided to punch it out almost backwards. First and only time I can recall hitting away from the flag
Some people are so judgemental. You can tell just by looking at 'em.--Some random meme
This… Courses don’t need to be longer. They need to be designed better. Narrow landing areas the farther you hit the ball. Hazards and obstacles placed strategically. Anyone recall the first US open at Bethpage? Corey Pavin, who won the open only a handful of years prior at
Shinnecock Hills, was hitting dew strips because he couldn’t make the initial carry to many of the fairways. Mean while the longer hitters had 50 yard wide fairways at 280+. This could have been the other way around….
As far as tech advancements, the ball has been the culprit for almost 25 years. The Precept Lady and Pro V1 were huge upticks from the old wound core with soft urethane/balata covers. Those older types of golf balls spun a lot. The spin was great for control on the ground. But they didn’t fly far with all that spin, so guys elected to play clubs at 6 7 degrees of loft. The low lofts would launch the ball on a more penetrating flight with that high spin the ball would carry farther on the lowing trajectory. The Pro V1 of that era spun less, came off the club faster, and allowed for higher trajectory creating more carry. It was the perfect blend in a golf ball. sufficient spin for the short game, iron shots were landing soft, and let you hit bombs with the driver. Clubs help but have been restricted so the ball has been more significant.
Golf really started to change in the late 90’s /early 2000’s. Prior to that time The game was about accuracy first then power. The old adage was “if you don’t know where your going to hit it than your hitting it to hard”. The best players were arcuate then powerful. That’s not to say that today’s players aren’t accurate and powerful but the prerequisite is distance then accuracy. Changes to the courses could have been made then. But distance draws attention. You hear people say “did you see how far he hit that!” And rarely “do you see how accurate he hit that!” What I’m driving at here is that distance was putting butts in the seats and sells equipment. There was such an influx of players at the time too. Some called it the tiger effect. I think it was a lot of things and he was definitely part of it. The game was a changing and so were the people whom took interest in the game. To capitalize it become the distance arms race. Every ball and club claimed to add 10 yards. And they sold a TON of drivers…….
I saw some nit wit from Taylor Made on TV once crying about the game is getting too hard for the average player because courses were too long. They were partly at fault for that! But his answer was to make the hole bigger, as it was his original idea. But it had been done before. Ben Hogan advocated for that larger hole concept. He was frustrated that he could hit the pall perfect twice make two put for the same score as the fella who scraped it three times and made the putt. They played some exhibition matches with a 10” hole. Turns out the better putter still won because he was making them from 50 feet instead of 5.
Anyway… I have too much useless golf knowledge.
When I'm on the tee, you hear people ask in a genuinely puzzled tone, "Do you have any idea WHERE he hit that?"
Some people are so judgemental. You can tell just by looking at 'em.--Some random meme
You made me smile. The extra distance for me meant I had to walk farther into the woods to pretend to find it. Foot wedge a few times to the edge with a clear shot just to duck hook it back into the woods. :)
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