Tournament of Champions 2012

[Lea]

<table width="90%" cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 align=center><tr><td>Quote, originally posted by bigfish1259 &raquo;</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">
As I said, I spoke with all 33 Champ entries about this issue, and all said they felt P.E., Flippin needed to step up and do something for the TOC, I think most are bitter because it looks like they are trying to kill off our brand while at the same time open our arms to theirs... I am more than willing to sit down, call or do what is necessary to talk with Jason Bragg, Randy Hopper or whoever to try and bridge this gap. I can't help but think they can do something to help the TOC, if I were selling boats in this economy I would do whatever it took to make the sell, that's just good business. It would also be nice to know we could use the Champ Logo for our own TOC without the threat of repercussion. I think it's time we put this issue to a vote among the Champ family and try and resolve it once and for all... Yes it is just a decal, but a corporate sponsor comes with it. Just remember if we don't try to work something out with P.E. now the chance of doing it in the future will most likely be impossible...</td></tr></table>

You are punishing current Elite owners (past prior Champion owners) for no reason. If you are pissed about the logo, it is a shame you are eliminating Elite owners for something they have no control over. PE could care less....Jason and his folks care a lot...but cannot dictate to PE. It seems a bunch of folks are all for including Elites. I cannot understand why some have been so adamant against. PE's may or may not be worrying about this one brand, no matter how deeply we care.

Hydra's post was dead on!!!!

[ssbassman]

I am with Lea on this one. Why would PE even consider it if you dont let the new boats in? Most guys buying the new elites are your true Champ guys so let them in. This is also being said by a current Champ owner but will NEVER BUY ANYTHING MADE IN FLIPPIN.

[jp71291]

Lea, the reason why is because we care. We want to be able to include them. But how can we accept them if they won't accept us. As stated in a previous thread, show up to the Stratos TOC in a Champion and they will look at you like you're crazy. We need to bridge this gap but unfortunately that is out of our hands. It's up to PE. And if there pockets are too deep to care about this brand, then why are they still producing them? Why didn't they sell the Champion name when someone tried to buy it? PE is a business and all businesses are in it to make money. Current Champion owners that don't choose to buy the Elites when they buy another boat will most likely buy something other than a PE brand. They won't buy a Ranger. (this is all my opinion and not meant to step on toes). Therefore, it is in PE's best interest to support the old Champs and the TOC. This tournament that Tom started could be our only chance to bridge the gap and I sure as heck hope it happens. All of us can work together to persuade PE to do the right thing.

<table width="90%" cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 align=center><tr><td>Quote, originally posted by ssbassman &raquo;</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">I am with Lea on this one. Why would PE even consider it if you dont let the new boats in? Most guys buying the new elites are your true Champ guys so let them in. This is also being said by a current Champ owner but will NEVER BUY ANYTHING MADE IN FLIPPIN.</td></tr></table>

As stated before, the new Elites will be allowed to enter next years TOC as long as PE gets involved. So it is there decision. IF they will support us then we will sure as heck support them. We all want the same thing, FOR THE CHAMPION HULL TO LIVE ON. Whether it has Champion or Stratos on the side doesn't matter. As long as both are accepted by PE.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong about what we all want..........sorry for the long post.

[bassfinder1]

HELLO, they are supporting us. Have you guys not seen how they are standing behind us on the repairs needed on our boats?, and under warranty. It kinda seems to me that the new elite owners are being punished and for what, a simple little decal. It is the same boat and better than ever. Butch has even agreed that the gel is flawless and the fit and finish is superior. Stratos was not the manufacturer of a 1975 to 2010 champion, so why would they let us in the tournament? Now stratos is the owner of one of the finest boats on the market and they are making it right with us. This whole P.E. had better get in on the action this year or never attitude is simply BULLSHIT........ Tom, I commend you on putting the tournament together and I am sure you guys had a lot of fun and I am not saying you did not run it correctly, so dont get offended. I know for a fact that Jason Bragg has watched all the haters on this forum so why would he give away any big prizes. I am sure that they will kick in something (whether it be some shirts, bags, cups, etc.) but I can assure everyone that I am not going up to bat for a group who doesn't believe in the product. I had a chance to jump ship when greg wood went to phoenix and I stayed true to my brand no matter what decal is on the side. I bet that maybe one or two of you haters only, have actually looked over the new elites because if more had they would know it is the same boat and top notch to boot.

[jp71291]

<table width="90%" cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 align=center><tr><td>Quote, originally posted by bassfinder1 &raquo;</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">HELLO, they are supporting us. Have you guys not seen how they are standing behind us on the repairs needed on our boats?, and under warranty. It kinda seems to me that the new elite owners are being punished and for what, a simple little decal. It is the same boat and better than ever. Butch has even agreed that the gel is flawless and the fit and finish is superior. Stratos was not the manufacturer of a 1975 to 2010 champion, so why would they let us in the tournament? Now stratos is the owner of one of the finest boats on the market and they are making it right with us. This whole P.E. had better get in on the action this year or never attitude is simply BULLSHIT........ Tom, I commend you on putting the tournament together and I am sure you guys had a lot of fun and I am not saying you did not run it correctly, so dont get offended. I know for a fact that Jason Bragg has watched all the haters on this forum so why would he give away any big prizes. I am sure that they will kick in something (whether it be some shirts, bags, cups, etc.) but I can assure everyone that I am not going up to bat for a group who doesn't believe in the product. I had a chance to jump ship when greg wood went to phoenix and I stayed true to my brand no matter what decal is on the side. I bet that maybe one or two of you haters only, have actually looked over the new elites because if more had they would know it is the same boat and top notch to boot.</td></tr></table>

Who said anything about "hating" the new elites? I even said it doesn't matter what name is on the side. I don't ever remember someone saying they hated the new elites or that they are a different boat. I really don't think that's the argument here. Maybe I'm wrong. And you said the new elite owners are being punished. Well you could say the same about the Champ owners. They won't allow us into their Stratos tournaments either so we are being punished too. And I am very suprised at their support of warranties. And very glad to hear it. They may not have produced the Champion hulls before 2010 but they took the same molds and are making the "same boat." If you are making the same boat and just re-arranged the name then they should accept Champions into their family COMPLETELY. Wish you could have made the TOC so I could have taken that demo ride in an elite.

[champ188]

<table width="90%" cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 align=center><tr><td>Quote, originally posted by bassfinder1 &raquo;</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">HELLO, they are supporting us. Have you guys not seen how they are standing behind us on the repairs needed on our boats?, and under warranty. It kinda seems to me that the new elite owners are being punished and for what, a simple little decal. It is the same boat and better than ever. Butch has even agreed that the gel is flawless and the fit and finish is superior. Stratos was not the manufacturer of a 1975 to 2010 champion, so why would they let us in the tournament? Now stratos is the owner of one of the finest boats on the market and they are making it right with us. This whole P.E. had better get in on the action this year or never attitude is simply BULLSHIT........ Tom, I commend you on putting the tournament together and I am sure you guys had a lot of fun and I am not saying you did not run it correctly, so dont get offended. I know for a fact that Jason Bragg has watched all the haters on this forum so why would he give away any big prizes. I am sure that they will kick in something (whether it be some shirts, bags, cups, etc.) but I can assure everyone that I am not going up to bat for a group who doesn't believe in the product. I had a chance to jump ship when greg wood went to phoenix and I stayed true to my brand no matter what decal is on the side. I bet that maybe one or two of you haters only, have actually looked over the new elites because if more had they would know it is the same boat and top notch to boot.</td></tr></table>


I always joke with my friends and buddies about us ChampioN owners being snobs, but I think ignoring the Elites because they have stratos on the side is rediculous. Personally I would buy an elite 202 in a heartbeat because its still a champion but the fact that I couldn't be apart of the TOC and enjoy the V-Wing hull with my fellow champion owners is BS. We can't have this TOC in hopes that one day PE will give us reconition, we should be having it to enjoy each others decision to buy the best hull on the planet, imo. I think we all need to step back and really look at why we want to be apart of the TOC, which I think is a great thing.

[bassin butch]

OK easy fix for PR: All the Champion clothing and other items that went to Flippn from Denny. How about Jason offering some stuff up? I sent him an IM last winter asking what was going to happen to this stuff? He replied not sure may offer it for sale on a web-site." I am still waiting.

[bigfish1259]

Bill, I was expressing the sentiment of every Champ owner who attended the TOC. I would love to include the Elites in our TOC, I am a lot like Butch and am anal to anything Champ, for that I apologize. And yes P.E. has created this gap between brands, so what if anything can be done about it? I think instead of us all throwing jabs at one another here, lets pull together and you and the other Elite owners here tell us what you can do and bring to the TOC and lets make this the best forum and TOC yet. I will personally stand behind the new Elites and push them with all revenues available to me. I just don't want anybody to forget the ChampioN brand...

Tom

[Steve 187]

[Champion190CX]

I agee with Lea 100%,Elites are part of our FAMILY..They could have went with another brand,but chose a ChampioN the only way they could get one..I know first-hand they are backing our boats warranty..MFI told me we didn't have ANY WARRANTY!.PE and the folks at Flippin stepped up to the plate with my trailer Issue,Also thanks FREEDOM Just my 2 cents worth

[bassfinder1]

Nobody will forget the champion brand. As to the gap that is so created everyone is saying it is due to P.E. but I personally believe that it is people not wanting to let them in or accept the switch. I am not trying to cause a big stink, but like I said they are not going to give away any huge prizes. I along with Lea will get ahold of our contacts and see what we can get done as far as anything they will wish to do. So, are you telling me that the new elites are allowed next year?

[bigfish1259]

We've never been against them. Just want the company to step up!!! And yes, let's bring them in and make this a really big show... Everybody, Champ owners included need to start working on sponsors... We have the date set and I'll take care of the regatta permit. If everybody's good with it, we'll make it a benefit for breast cancer 80% payback??? I'll check with the Chamber of Commerce at Cape Fair and get a rally point/ buffet dinner set up. If someone would like to take the lead on the land events such as BBQ, casting contest, etc., etc. let me know and I'll help coordinate it. I will also check with the Branson Chamber of Commerce and see if can get some discounts on events such as Silver Dollar City and the Branson Belle. Lets move forward with this and show everyone why it's great to be part of the Champ Family...

[Lea]

<table width="90%" cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 align=center><tr><td>Quote, originally posted by bigfish1259 &raquo;</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Bill, I was expressing the sentiment of every Champ owner who attended the TOC. I would love to include the Elites in our TOC. I will personally stand behind the new Elites and push them with all revenues available to me. I just don't want anybody to forget the ChampioN brand...

Tom</td></tr></table>

Good deal, Tom! No one is going to forget the Champion brand!!!!! Between those of us who love the brand, we will not ever permit that to happen. PE is supporting us, but we can't ask for too much too soon.

When someone complains that our Champions would not be permitted in a Stratos T, they need to remember that our Champions were never Stratoses. The Elites were and are, Champions. I am really glad to hear that the Elites will be included in the TOCs!!!

Demanding that PE support our TOC is asking an awful lot at this point. They have proven they support us with their warranty coverage, which they did not have to agree to in the bankruptcy proceedings. I am not sure how many brands currently support owners' Ts, but we were bought out of bankruptcy and I think it's going to take some time and our support for our brand to gain that much further support from PE.

I hope we all can work together to support all our Champions, and that the support will result in improved sales and security for our future...regardless of decals.

[Skip]

Here is how I see it, PE bought 4 boat companies. They scrubbed ChampioN and took a few of thier better hulls and gave them to Stratos. With the Elite's what you have is a Stratos with a ChampioN hull design under it. They are Stratos boats not a ChampioN. PE has to include warranty on our boats as it does for the other boats it bought wheater they build our boat or not. There is nothing wrong with a Stratos boat many people run them. There is a long list of boat brands that have gone to the wayside, now ChampioN is one of them. I have a fine ChampioN that will last me for several more years and I'm happy about that. If my wife and I can make the 2012 TOC we will.

[Tx Champ]

<table width="90%" cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 align=center><tr><td>Quote, originally posted by bigfish1259 &raquo;</td></tr><tr><td class="quote">Bill, I was expressing the sentiment of every Champ owner who attended the TOC. I would love to include the Elites in our TOC, I am a lot like Butch and am anal to anything Champ, for that I apologize. And yes P.E. has created this gap between brands, so what if anything can be done about it? I think instead of us all throwing jabs at one another here, lets pull together and you and the other Elite owners here tell us what you can do and bring to the TOC and lets make this the best forum and TOC yet. I will personally stand behind the new Elites and push them with all revenues available to me. I just don't want anybody to forget the ChampioN brand...

Tom</td></tr></table>

I don't think that will ever happen ... There are boats owned by some on this forum 25 years old or better. There will always be a ChampioN cult ...

[Steve 187]

[bassfinder1]

Thank you very much tom. I will work on my sponsors and Stratos. I can't tell you how much this is appreciated by a lot of people.

[bigfish1259]

Bill, You can take the lead for the Elites, we can set up and have a pic session and boat show at the rally/ buffet dinner the night before and some demo rides after the weigh -in, just let me know what you need...

[bassfinder1]

Will do

[jp71291]

I have an idea for the tourney. Along with the flyers that are made, maybe attach an agenda. You can show all the events in the agenda along with the times. This will help to organize and promote everything that we plan on doing.