E Tec help

[capnlee]

I recently bought a boat with a 75hp E Tec and I have been having some issues. The dealer I bought it from is, to say the least, WAY behind the technology curve. The problems started out minor, but seem to be multiplying rapidly. I have found another authorized BRP service center in my state (there are only 2 in New Mexico). I think my issues may have more to do with the way the boat is rigged rather than the motor itself. It seems like there are electrical ghosts in there somewhere wreaking havoc. Anyway, before I take my boat to another shop, I would like to know if my motor has the latest updates.

Thanks,
Lee

E75DPLSD
05134363

[BigHarry]

What is it doing? Help is on the way!

[rudetech1]

Have them put the latest version on, it is for 07' motors. What kind of problems are you having?

[capnlee]

OK, you guys asked. Go get a cup of coffee and sit down for a nice long read. I will keep it as brief as possible, but I'm sure this is gonna take a while.

Day one: everything was fine on initial run but the tach quit working on the way back to the ramp. Service guy looked at it and said it was still getting power, just the needle wasn't working. He was very busy and couldn't troubleshoot right away. He said to go ahead and take it and bring it back at my convenience. No Tach being a minor inconvenience I had my new boat and I was on my way.

Day two: Took the boat out (different lake 1.5 hours away from the dealer). A couple of hours into the outing, the trim gauge quit working. A little later I was under power and something beeped at me. It kind of caught me off guard, but I think it was 3 or 4 beeps. I stopped the boat and turned everything off. I fired it up again and everything seemed to be working fine (with the exception of the gauges). I went back to camp to escape the heat and was going to take the boat out again in the evening. When I fired up the boat I noticed the "Check Engine" light was on. It may have been on earlier in the day, but I hadn't noticed it in the bright sunlight—not sure. I checked my manual and it said something to the effect if the light was constant and the engine did not go into SAFE mode it would be OK to run it, but have the dealer check it out at earliest convenience. When I got under power, the light would flicker off and on. I didn’t think this was the blinking light the manual warned could be more serious, but just to be safe I put it on the trailer and took it back to the dealer the next day.

The boat sat at the dealer for three weeks, and the service department (a guy named Larry) kept telling me he would get to it when he wasn't so busy or it wasn't too hot out to work on it---I'm not kidding. He finally said he had checked it out. The gauges were getting power, but not enough. He didn't know why. The engine hadn't stored any error codes and he would have to look into it further. I called a few times last week to see if they were making any progress. They weren't. I wanted to pick up my boat on Friday and they said it would be ready. I went to pick it up on Friday and still had no tach and no trim gauge and the "Check Engine" light was still on. Larry said I should take it to someone who knows a little more about troubleshooting these engines 'cause it still had him scratching his head---again, I'm not kidding. They said it would be fine to take it out fishing, so I'm on my way again thinking I'll take Larry's advice.

Past weekend: I started out without a tach or trim gauge and constant "Check Engine" light. More than a minor inconvenience, but I'm still able to fish.

[Side note---the dealer had switched my prop from a 15p to a 13p 'cause with the 15 I had only been able to troll down to 3mph. 13p got me down to 2.3mph gps. I'd like to know if the motor has been set to idle as slow as possible, but I don't want to ask Larry. I dropped from about 38mph at WOT to 33.5mph WOT]

Saturday: About an hour into my fishing day I notice that the trim up button doesn't work from the helm. It still works on the motor. I'm still able to fish, so I'm OK. A little while later, the boat is under power pretty close to WOT and the motor just quits. I turn everything completely off and start up again and it seems to be running OK. I get underway for a little while and then the motor quits again, and again it restarts. It still seems to work at low RPM, so I keep trolling. My buddy catches a fish and I begin to reel my line in and hook one also, so I turn the motor off. We each land our fish and I go to start the motor. It is completely dead. I still have power to everything else, just nothing to the motor. I checked all the in dash fuses and found another one under the dash and they all look good. I don't generally bring my phone with me when I fish, but on this day I had. I called Larry and he said it sounded like a fuse had blown. I asked him if he knew of any fuses on the motor because I couldn't find one. He said he would have to look it up in the manual and give me a call back. I have to give Larry some credit, 'cause in about thirty minutes he called me back and told me where to find the fuse and a spare---man, that fuse is well hidden. I am able to troll the 5 or 6 miles back to the ramp without incident. The weather is perfect, the beer is cold and the fishing is good, so I'm feeling OK.

Sunday: After some debate with my fishing partner about whether or not we should fish, it is decided we should and we will just stay close to the ramp. We bought some spare fuses just in case. We trolled for a couple of hours and caught a few fish without incident and decided to call it a day. While my partner was backing the trailer in the water, the fuse on the motor blew again. I changed it out and since it was still morning and I hadn't had much to drink I had the presence of mind to tilt the motor up. Good thing, 'cause the fuse blew again. We managed to winch the boat onto the trailer and get it out of the water. I was able to get the motor tilted into towing postion before blowing another fuse. Just out of curiosity I tried to put another fuse in: it popped immediately.

It is probably important for me to mention a few other things about the boat. It is a Lund and it was factory pre-rigged, but not with BRP gauges or controls. (See my post from a couple of weeks ago titled "E Tec Gauges") It also shipped without a trim gauge, which the dealer installed. Larry has since told me it is a BRP gauge. It looks identical to the others and I don't know how to tell the difference. It seems to me that there is likely a short somewhere in the system. It also seems more likely to me that it is in the wiring of the boat and has nothing to do with the motor, but maybe not.

My concern now is this: If I take it to another authorized BRP tech, and the problem turns out to be in the boat and not the motor, will my warranty still be honored by Lund? Since originally posting this topic, I posed this question to my dealer. He said he would prefer I bring it back to him so there would be no question. Let me say, I have been VERY patient and polite with him about everything up to this point (and there is more to the story), but today I had to mention that I had a little problem with Larry's work ethic and his lack of technical knowledge and that the shop I want to take it to has all the latest technology. I haven't mentioned to him that Larry suggested I take the boat somewhere else. In all honesty, the dealer is one of the nicest and most likeable guys I have ever met, and today he gave me his word that if I would bring it back to him he would take care of me right away and if he had to hire someone to come in and fix it he would no matter what it cost him. His dealership is about 200 miles away, but he said he'd meet me halfway. His heart is in the right place and he wants to make me a happy customer, but at this point I'm almost ready to take it to the other shop even if I have to pay them. The other shop has a stellar reputation and their rigger/mechanic is known for being able to fix boats that other people have mucked up.

OK, I apologize for the novella here, but maybe I included something that will give you folks insight as to what the problem is. If not, well then just let me thank you for letting me vent. I hope you're not sorry for asking what kind of problems I'm having.

Thanks Much,
Lee

[marinemech1]

this is why they need better factory training

[rudetech1]

If the boat is rigged up from the factory, chances are there may be a short in the system. Tin boats tend to have screws ran thru thr wire harnesses or rough edges that touch the harness or something. If you are blowing fuses, you have a short to ground on a main b+ circut. Might be in the control box, might be in the boat. Make sure there are no wing nuts on the battery, use hex nuts. If there are no codes on the EMM, chances are there is nothing wrong with the motor. Any short or loose connection will cause havoc thru the system. If the boat is under warranty, they need to get you taken care of. If not, call Lund. They may pay to have some one else fix it. I have had a few that were brought to us that were fixed and they were not our brand. The engine can be set at idle to allow for slower troll RPMs, so why not run the 15p for the mileage. This is why the screen says IDLE ADJUST on the laptop. I'm with you, I thik it's a setup issue, not an engine issue. There are a few other items that need to be checked on the engine but it sound like this guy would'nt know what so i'd take it to the other guy.

[SEAHORSE]

From reading your post, I concur with Rudetech1 that it is probably a rigging problem.

Since you say the dealer is so nice, ask him to have Larry call the factory's tech "hot line" and get talked thru the testing procedure. Also call the customer service line, with your serial number, at 847 689 7090 and tell them your story.

Take a look at your battery or batteries and make sure there are NO wing nuts on the terminals, that the cables are tight, and that hex-nuts are used to fasten the cables to the battery.

Let us know what they find out.

[Byrdseye]

For what it is worth, I've been impressed with the E-Tec knowledge the service manager at the Navajo Dam establishment posseses. I've been less impressed by his speediness though. ( it is high season and it's a one man show!) Hopefully I'll have my 250 out on the lake this weekend and see if it's finally fixed. Have you been going to the shop in T or C?

[61Woody]

Don't know if this has anything to do with it but since Lund is owned by Brunswick now they don't(Ithink) pre-rig for BRP or anyone else for that matter except Merc. My local Crestliner dealer was telling while you can still put anything you want on the Brunswick boats the Dealer has to do ALL the setup. I have nothing but good thingd to say about my 75 e-tec, great motor.

P.S. Hey mods since I have a 06 would there be any benifit to getting the latest updates that are on the 07's?

[capnlee]

Birdseye,

No, the shop I have been dealing with is not the one in T or C--they are the ones I have heard good things about and in talking to them on the phone they seem very knowledgable and professional. I have been taking it to the dealer who is on the east side of the state.

Hawkeye,

Yes, Brunswick bought out Lund. '06 is the last year you will be able to buy a Lund with a 'Rude. '07 year will be the last for Honda. From then out-according to my dealer-all Lunds will come prerigged for Merc.

[capnlee]

OK folks,

I have decided to give the dealer one more shot at this. He said he has a guy coming with a laptop. I'm not sure I know what that means, but if my boat gets fixed I will be very happy. I did check the battery and there are no wing nuts. The hex nuts are tight. I appreciate all the input and suggestions. I'll let you guys know how it turns out.

Thanks,
Lee

[capnlee]

The guy with the laptop showed up. They can't get the laptop to talk to the motor-or any other E Tec for that matter. When they plug it in they get a "bootstrap error". Have any of the gurus here seen this bootstrap error when connecting to the motor and do you know the fix? They said they called tech support and were told something about configuring com ports, but the way the guy with the laptop explained it to me the connection to the computer is USB to a serial port on the motor. There should be no com port to configure---correct? If anyone knows a fix I can share with them it would be greatly appreciated. The computer is running Windows XP.

They did say they found a short in the wiring loom on the motor, by the way.

Thanks,
Lee

[rudetech1]

I use a serial port, com port 1. I do not use the usb port. The only time I get a boot strap error is when I accidentaly go into the EMM Program Enhancement.

[capnlee]

So he needs a com (9 pin) to serial (9 pin) cable? Is there anything that needs to be configured for XP, or does the evinrude software take care of this?

[AquaMarineNJ]

THEY ARE USING A SERIAL PORT ADAPTER THAT PLUGS INTO A USB PORT. WHEN YOU ARE USING IT, IT SHOULD CONFIGURE TO A COM PORT. (I USE ONE TO HOT SYNC OUR PDAs. it likes com 4 on ours) Sorry cap locks on. There should have been a disk that came with the usb to serial adapter. Try changing the com ports first. Then resort to reconfiguring the adapter.

One thing to remember is that not all serial adapters work correctly. It is better to go directly to the serial port if the computer has one.

I think you can go into the windows device manager & find what com the adapter is using.

[AquaMarineNJ]

If he used a cord from the motor and had it connected to the computer he must have had an adpater in line with the cord.

As per the comment it does not work on any engine.
Has it ever worked with the usb adapter for that tech?

If Not,

go to "start"
then "control panel"
double click on "system"
select "hardware"
go to "device manager"
select "ports" (com&lpt)

See where the usd adapter is set.

Is The Adapter Under "Port" in the "device manager"??? Yes Or No

If Yes, there is your com port (use that port to configure the motor software)

If Adapter Com is not there. Go down to usb & see if the adapter is there/installed. is it there? Yes Or NO

No, Install the drivers that came with the adapter.

Yes, uninstall & re-install the drivers (possible with the latest drives from the adapters web site) install the drivers first and without the usb adapter installed. When the Installation is done. turn on or up the speaker on the labtop. plug in the usb adapter. it should have made a bling bling. there should have been a usb symbol appear on the bottom right of the bottom bar. put your mouse on it & see what it said. (device installed correctly should be it's final response before it goes away.) go back into the device manager & find out what port it is on.

after all of this mess Configure Evidiag where the com port is set. or just try com 1-4 if the adapter installed and the adapter is compatible then it should work.

Other than this try a different brand of usb to serial adapter. As I said before not all adapters are compatible or have drivers that will work properly.

Sorry if this is alot but print it out and try this. I have had this problem a while ago and that is why I will only buy a labtop with a serial port.

Maybe have a computer oriented person do this because in my experience most Marine techs will get lost.

Although there bottom painter may be qualified. Sorry inside joke




Modified by AquaMarineNJ at 4:22 PM 8/28/2006

[capnlee]

Thanks-it's beginning to make sense to me now. So let me make sure I have this straight:

The software is not compatible with USB, so he needs to either use a computer with a COM port (preferable) or get a USB to Serial adapter. Windows XP should install the adapter automatically--if not, then he needs to get the drivers from the vendors CD or website.

The adaptor plugs into the USB port and is 9 pin male so he will need a 9 pin com to 9 pin serial cable.

If it still doesn't work, reconfigure the COM port to COM 2, 3 or 4.

I did confirm that he was trying to go directly from USB to serial, so it looks like this is the problem.

Thanks so much for all the help! I am a computer tech by trade, but don't often try to do it from 200 miles away. You guys may have just saved me another week without a boat!

[AquaMarineNJ]

sometimes a conflict in windows will either not install the device/adapter and/or not install it fully and/or set it on a higher com port.

Some adapters, although install, do not work. I'm not sure why but that is the adapter companies question. Some adapters work fine in dells, gateway & do not work in compaqs or the other way around or so on. It's not so cut and dry to what brand of adapter to buy or I would have sent you to the store first.

hopfully this helps.

hopefuly you can help the tech get the drivers installed. (That's odd right)

[capnlee]

Yes, it helps a lot. It at least gives them something to try--they had reached a dead end. And I get to charge them 60 bucks an hour for tech support! (just kidding)

I'll be sure to let you know how it works out.

Thanks again!

[AquaMarineNJ]

One more thing, they will have to install inline update from dealerport to update the map in a 75hp Etec.

Inline update com port is 1 by default. call brp on how to set it up to another com port.


Modified by AquaMarineNJ at 5:24 PM 8/28/2006