Diagnose This

[esdbass]

OK I already know what happened here but only Don and Redline also know so this could be fun to hear what people think it was

Symptoms: Motor starts and started fine, idled well and warmed up to 125* on smart craft before it was put on plane. Boat planed out OK but it's a big wheel 32" 4 Blade ET cut that I've never ran and I got a full tank. Boat accelerates OK and starts running WOT is running maybe 5500+ RPM's and I'm playing with jack and trim. Get to end off pass and it just didn't seem to really have it's normal pulling power, make another pass and pretty much the same thing except it seemed to get to 5500 and then stop pulling infact it started slowing down, I was doing 97 MPH or so and where it should have been accelerating it starts losing speed down to about 94 MPH. Well this isn't so good is the prop cupped to much or am I pulling the plate too much, is it trim??? OK some more data all this time engine temp is never above 140* all other things like water pressure etc etc are fine NO alarms NO nothing.

OK I go to make one more pass this time it starts to really pull I'm at 97.4 MPH and maybe 5500 to 5700 RPMs and all of a sudden the boat looses a lot of power and motor starts surging and stumbling a little. I back out of it just a bit and the motor really starts to die on me and loose power to the point it almost stalls. I turn the boat back toward the ramp and am idling after a minute or two I try to put it up on plane and it does but soon after it starts loosing power at a slower speed with less throttle advancement, I take it off plane and idle under power and hope it won't die I idle back near the ramp and look behind me and I notice there is no water stream coming out the weep hole yet on the smart craft it's showing 3.1 to 3.8 PSI in neutral and an engine temp of 114* to 118*. I try to clear the weep hole with a long piece of wire and re start the motor and still no water coming out of weep hole but the PSI and Water temp on the smart craft are again fine. OK I put it up on plane which it does and just start cruising at about 40 MPH and it starts to die and stumble again.

When I get back to the ramp and put it on the trailer I notice some water dripping out of the engine rigging hose and from the lower cowl.

Now during all of this there has never been one code one alarm NOTHING and it's running with in temp and PSI parameters but nothing is coming out the weep hole and the boat falls on it's head and is stalling after a short run.

SO WHAT WAS IT ?

OH: It's an 08 250 XS with a 1.62 Titus sportsmaster on a Stroker


PS Sorry about the length but I wanted everyone to have complete info


Modified by esdbass at 4:54 PM 6/5/2009

[EuropeanAM]

[NixaMan]

Pinched fuel line was causing it to starve for fuel on the upper end.

[esdbass]

Is that your final answer

come on guys any others want to guess

[Oldgeezer]

My guess. An erratic or failing engine temperature sensor will reduce the final degree timing and reduce the power of the motor?

[STROKEDYAMAHA]

Yankee knot head knocked off water hose when messing with motor......

[Ohirolina]

Could the tell tale hose come loose and spray water
inside the cowl and on the ground to the motor?

[Beast96Z]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by STROKEDYAMAHA &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> knocked off water hose when messing with motor...... </TD></TR></TABLE>That would be my guess. Knocked off the hose and filled the cowl with water. Water on something electrical under the hood caused the power loss?

[esdbass]

Any other thoughts or guesses ???

[Corkpuller]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Beast96Z &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That would be my guess. Knocked off the hose and filled the cowl with water. Water on something electrical under the hood caused the power loss?</TD></TR></TABLE>

+1

[Hawkman]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Beast96Z &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That would be my guess. Knocked off the hose and filled the cowl with water. Water on something electrical under the hood caused the power loss?</TD></TR></TABLE>
+2 I've had that happen

[esdbass]

Well Paul Hottman was the closet to guessing what was wrong, I think he had some help though from a "tweety bird" who also was told.





Now here is what actually was the problem was:

It was a "Water leak from the feed line to the compressor, hose clamp. Where it is clamped on with the hose clamp it came off! My tech said it was like a fountain of water going every where when they started it up Guess some how it loosened up and backed off? It's a covered area so taking the cowl on and off should never bang against it so ?????

They just reattached it and checked the motor on the CDS, no faults no codes and the air compressor was OK with no faults either

So the water was never making it to the weep hole to start with but it was still showing on the smart craft, it was spraying so bad under the cover for the fly wheel and the compressor that some water would drain or whatever into the plenum intake and then that was stalling and loss of power with the motor. Also electrical shorting etc could be involved, guess it was pretty funny they said to see water spurting out all over the place, they said "guess Eli's right and he's got a water leak"

Redline and Don says this acts at this minor amount like "injector cleaning" Yikes I hope so and that it's not going to cause a hot spot we'll see I guess

[STROKEDYAMAHA]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by esdbass &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well Paul Hottman was the closet to guessing what was wrong, I think he had some help though from a "tweety bird" who also was told.



: </TD></TR></TABLE>

Sorry no help from tweety.....

[esdbass]

Must have been from one of your aspiring "Stroker Shirt" models JKA Good call on that Hottfoot

[Oldgeezer]

If nothing else, it was fun. We all need a little of this these days!

[Oldgeezer]

However, in the engineering world inquiring minds are interested in the "root" cause of the fault? Might the experts(Don/Redline/others) care to identify the original fault so that we might not experience Eli's fault ?

[Largemouthlou]

Yup,,,, yankee knot head syndrom!!

[EuropeanAM]

Ok, I've stayed out to let Eli have some fun.....

When Eli and I spoke about this early on, I did tell him that the symptoms were mimicking a fuel starvation issue.

However.... when he referred to the "no telltale stream".... I strongly encouraged him to STOP, and locate the CAUSE of the "no telltale stream" issue. Clean the fitting out, remove the cowling, and check that cooling circuit- fitting at the adapter (has a screen), hose to the compressor, and hose from the compressor to the telltale.

A wise man (my original training technician, many many years ago) drilled me over and over that you should "ALWAYS FIX THE OBVIOUS... BEFORE YOU GO HUNTING FOR THE OBSCURE".

This particular scenario is a PERFECT example.

Of course, the motor is 1000 or so miles from me.... and Eli/Bob got to see "first hand" what was going on. I particularly wonder if the spraying water wasn't interfering with the CPS (crank position sensor) signal, and or Direct Injector/Fuel Injector connections.... but the important thing is that the water is now routed "where it belongs".

The best diagnostic tool for this issue: TWO (functional) EYEBALLS.

[esdbass]

"The best diagnostic tool for this issue: TWO (functional) EYEBALLS."

Don that and a full set of rain gear, from what I was told when they cranked it up there was water flying everywhere

Ran it today with Deb on a small lake didn't really run all that long but seemed like "no probs" we'll put the hammer down to her some time this week and see if everything is OK

Don it's interesting though how it seemed like it legitimately could have been several things????? In my opinion the most telling was that there was water draining out of the rigging tube and cowl when it was tilted at the ramp, the cover over the flywheel and compressor hides that area so unless you start taking stuff off it isn't just take the cowl off and bingo

[redline]

Yep, Jeff and I certainly didn't stay dry....kinda laughed about it for awhile. A good lesson though. It is strongly encouraged to have a look see under the cowl now and then. It doesn't hurt to "give a tug" or put a wrench on some of the fasteners. They do loosen up now and again.......not meant to re-torque, but to make sure they aren't LOOSE. I tell Eli before he lauches his boat to go over the jack mounting bolts, steering connections, skeg, prop, etc., before he even turns the key.