Don/Redline(Bob)other experts-15% Ethanol proposal-What do we do if passed

[Oldgeezer]

There is Legislation being proposed where Ethanol would be at a 15% concentration .vs. a 10% which we are currently living with and taking as many precautions as possible. I own a Pro XB 250 EFI where my owners manual from Mercury clearly states that an Ethanol percentage exceeding 10 percent will be a "problem" and could possibly "harm" my motor. What can we do to mitigate this problem if in fact this legislation is passed and approved by the elements in the Government that are are no longer concerned with the future outlook of the "barely" middle class as most of us are considered as? Perhaps my age at 63 seems to have an "edge" to it but I am really concerned. I look forward to any and all possible solutions to this possible problem. Thanks to all that try to help with this.

[EuropeanAM]

In answer to your question, Mercury has been researching the effects of higher ethanol concentrations.

The outlook on that subject is NOT good... most of the outboards build in recent years will "tolerate" 10%, but 15% is beyond the "tolerable limits" of the engine in many cases.

If indeed this is passed... there will be a market for retrofit kits designed to "help the engine cope" with higher ethanol content (although I personally doubt that any widespread success/coverage will be had, since the fuel pumps themselves are just not capable of tolerating that level of ethanol in the "long-term").

We went through a similar issue back in the 1980's as "lead" was removed from fuel, and various other additives added (including forms of ethyl and methyl alcohol). Some engines lived with fuel system upgrades.... and some Inboard/Outboard engines either received upgraded (harder) valves & seats, or lived "a very short lifespan".

And if you happen to remember the term "gasohol" (I called it "liquid engine death")... or even worse, tried to run it for any length of time....

[MIZ-ZOU]

Don,

I found out recently that a local gas station does have 91 octane fuel that does not contain ethanol. I run an '08 225 ProXS, requiring only 87 octane.

Is it better to run the ethanol free 91 or stick with the 10% laden 87 octane? Will the performance and peace of mind offset the $0.34/gallon price difference?

[esdbass]

Good question for Don but it won't run faster/better on the 91 octane based on just the higher octane BUT the non ethanol gas will not have the same stability probs and water absorption issues. It will be interesting what he thinks.

[EuropeanAM]

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tr200X2Seth &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Don,

I found out recently that a local gas station does have 91 octane fuel that does not contain ethanol. I run an '08 225 ProXS, requiring only 87 octane.

Is it better to run the ethanol free 91 or stick with the 10% laden 87 octane? Will the performance and peace of mind offset the $0.34/gallon price difference?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hmmmnnn.... that's a tough one. I would be inclined to look at their mid-grade fuel, and determine what "it's" ethanol content is.

First and foremost.... I would get my hands on an ethanol test kit (see sticky post at the top of this forum). Confirm (by your OWN test- not what you're being told) what the ethanol contents are on the different grades they offer.

If I had a choice of running 87 octane w/6% ethanol, or 91 octane with none, I'd be inclined to run the 87. The decision would change, of course... depending on the "actual" level of ethanol.

"10%" can mean anything from .01% to 10%. That's a pretty wide range... and without actual testing, you never know!

The problem here is that you have to remember that fuel "formulas" change with the seasons. Hence... what you figure out for "today", may not apply in August or September... and certainly not for "December".

[MIZ-ZOU]

Thanks, I'll get a test kit and check the local stations. There is one station that always seems to give me better mileage in my truck. It will be interesting to see if the ethanol content is why.

Thanks again!

[NoSloProcraft]

Besides the affects on our fuel systems, what affect does this have on the motors performance and longevity. If the Ethanol causes a lean condition or whatever can't that be solved with an ECU reflash or a carb rejetting?

[EuropeanAM]

Lean condition "might" be solved with rejetting or recalibration- the issue would be that such a change would be "permanent".

If you went to lower, or no ethanol content... you might be "rich".

Ethanol's effects on the engine include: Deterioration of rubber and neoprene parts, corossion of nearly every metal the fuel comes into contact with, introduction of (or attraction of) moisture, lower butane rating (resulting in lower power output), lower boiling point (leaving engine more likely to experience vapor lock issues), lean running conditions, etc. etc. etc.

[Ohirolina]

Don,
You need to design an additive like Quick Kleen to over come this, something like Octane boost etc.

I'll come up with the ideas, Terry can be the head of sales, (You and I both know he has tons of what it takes to be a successful salesman) and you can be the head of design. We'll be rich. Rich I tell ya

[Largemouthlou]

Ron, I think that has already been done!!

[Ohirolina]

If thats already available, then someone owes me tons of money for stealing my idea What is it called? How expensive?

[redline]

Agreed here as well. We have seen "Ethanol content" range from 6% to a whopping 18%. There seems to be no consistency to an already problemsome fuel. Compound everything stated in these posts to the "incompatibility" with two stroke oils when water is introduced and we have issues. I might make mention that although we are Merc guys here { :) }, we service all makes and models, and see the issue everywhere. Carbed I/O's are giving us the most fits. As far as the water absorbsion goes, the only stuff I've seen work is a product called E-Zorb, made by MDR. Try it yourself before you dump it into your fuel tank. Put a little fuel into a clear container, add a little water, watch the phase separation occur, add the E-zorb, and the water will disperse into very small molecules, and emulsify enough with the fuel to be burned without issue. It's as about as close to the "magic elixer" that I've come across. The only problem is that it needs to be introduced in EQUAL proportions to the content of water or it is ineffective....so how do you do that? You don't. If water is discovered, you pump out all the old junk, start new, and then use that stuff to prevent water from "appearing", as a preventative measure. I would prefer to see full tanks of fuel, stabilized and quickleened, and used frequently, to avoid this mess, and this method has been somewhat consistent here with good results. Food for thought............:)

BTW....sorry I haven't been around, but lurk once in awhile, because I'm really busy......

[Oldgeezer]

Here is Mercury Marines' position on the proposed 15% ethanol "exception". Excellent to see that they are trying to protect us as owners of Mercury engines from potential major problems. It is an interesting document.
http://www.regulations.gov/sea...ate|1

[carolina killer]

That is great I hope that the other marine manufacturers will step in and say something about it..
My truck will run on the E85 fuel .. I thought that I would give it a try even though the price per gallon was about the same.. I figured that I would do the good deed of trying to cut back on fossil fuel..
I could not believe how it effected my fuel mileage as well as how weak my truck was.. I dropped 3 mpg and it really strained my truck to pull my boat which I know isn't good for my truck engine.. NO MORE E85 fuel for me..
I really hope that they don't pass this into law it will really have a very adverse effect on the marine industry..