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  1. #1
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    Livescope Hype Hard to Overcome

    On an ice fishing site I posted about how affordable the PS22 is becoming. While there were quite a few views. There was not one response. In the same forum someone posted about livescope being the ultimate panoptix. It had many responses.

    I used the PS 21 then the PS 22 when it came out for ice fishing. Last year on about a 20 acre pond fished with my setup vs another guy who had the livescope lvs32. Here were my observations.

    1. My setup with 9 inch screen way cheaper vs his 7 inch screen both echomaps mine a chirp his a plus.
    2. Time to find fish about equal
    3. My setup drew less power.
    4. Livescope had way more definition as it should. Objects like fish are displayed smaller livescope vs the older panoptix.
    5. Actually switched setups for 30 minutes . Both of us were glad when the 1/2 hour was up . ;-0
    6. I caught more fish. But way more experience on my part. Like about 40 years.

    What I was trying to convey to the ice anglers. If you can not afford the livescope route. Why not go with the older more affordable Panoptix ? I get that the new tech is always going to draw the most attention. But by buying a used PS 22 one would be saving @ 1K right there. Instead of buying a manufactured shuttle. I made one out of a five gallon bucket. Used some of the money I saved on that to spring for lithium batteries. For the PS 22 made a deploy item out of PVC. Cost under 10 as opposed to 99.00.
    Helix Mega 10 SI G2N , ILink
    Garmin 1040 XS / Garmin 1242 xsv with Panoptix Down VU PS 30 W/ GCV 10 networked with PS 31. Boat Rig

    Echomap Ultra 106 SV with Livescope 12 . Ice Rig

  2. Member
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    #2
    You make some really good points. Every technology has a best case scenario use and a worst case scenario use. It's up the the fisherman to make the most of what advantages any technology offers. I have a PS22 and LVS32 mounted on my TM. When fishing is tough, like today was, and I'm forced to look at longer distances to find something, the PS22 really shines. I set the range to 160 ft because from my testing I saw that it would show me a single fish at that distance. When the forward range of the LVS is extended more than about 80 ft the fish returns get too small to really catch my attention. They are there, but I might miss them. Side imaging is the same way. I run it out too. Schools show up good but individual fish can easily be missed. They are still there, but really small. Both the PS30 and PS22 show returns instantly and easily recognizable. Never found any walleye today so I had to settle for spot and smallmouth fishing. It was the PS22 and PS30 that carried the day.
    My wife asks if I'm going to fish every day. I can't fish every day. Some days I might be sick.

  3. Member
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    #3
    I have said before that the PS22 and for that matter the 45Deg 21 are better tools than what most give them credit for. And that is especially true if you are a lake fisherman.
    Like Leonard said the 22 is easier to see fish with at the longer distance. Neither have the detail of the livescope but detail is not much good if you cant find anything to see.
    I can tell the difference most of the time between schools of bait fish and crappie ,bass , catfish and such with the 22,not so much with the 21 but it is a lot easier to keep up with moving school with it than either the 22 or livescope.

    Leonard mentioned the PS30 which I have. I admit when I first got it I was less than happy but that was because my lack of understanding and research as to what to expect. My son talked me into keeping it and im glad he did. I still have not got to use it where I intended to use it the most , river has been flooded and not a open ramp for 13 miles , but it wont be long now.
    I have been using it for vertical jigging and drifting when I make the 65 mile trip to a fishable lake. In that capacity it shines and no one is getting it. When drifting for catfish or crappie I can see all four of my baits and see the depths I need to keep them at. Good stuff.

    Livescope is good stuff but it like the others is just another tool.

    Like the op said with the price the 22s are going for and the budget is tight you cannot go wrong.

  4. Member
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    #4
    I wonder how long until Garmin releases one livescope transducer with multiple cone angle and frequency options

  5. Member
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    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Eyehunter83 View Post
    I wonder how long until Garmin releases one livescope transducer with multiple cone angle and frequency options
    If they do it will probably be faster than I can afford to buy it

  6. Charger Boats Moderator TOUCH OF CLASS's Avatar
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    #6
    My buddy has Panoptix neither of us like it and I was not on board garmin until scope and now Iam very very happy,but as a few have said they like Panoptix over scope.I really think if garmin wouldn’t of came out with scope they never would of took the market like they have and even their side scan and down has gotten notice because of it.It will only get better from here on out!

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    #7
    Quote Originally Posted by TOUCH OF CLASS View Post
    My buddy has Panoptix neither of us like it and I was not on board garmin until scope and now Iam very very happy,but as a few have said they like Panoptix over scope.I really think if garmin wouldn’t of came out with scope they never would of took the market like they have and even their side scan and down has gotten notice because of it.It will only get better from here on out!
    Sometimes we just don’t know a good thing when we see it. Like any other tool you
    have you have to know when and how to use it.
    Im not real concern with Garmins market.
    Now if they started supplying me with equipment I might be.

  8. Charger Boats Moderator TOUCH OF CLASS's Avatar
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    #8
    Iam just hoping they see the big picture and keep improving on their fishing side .

  9. Member
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    #9
    Just to elaborate on my original post. My post on original panoptix 174 views - 0 replies. Post about livescope being expensive 4315 views- 41 replies.
    I guess market hype will always over rule actual experience.
    Helix Mega 10 SI G2N , ILink
    Garmin 1040 XS / Garmin 1242 xsv with Panoptix Down VU PS 30 W/ GCV 10 networked with PS 31. Boat Rig

    Echomap Ultra 106 SV with Livescope 12 . Ice Rig

  10. Member
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    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by hays47 View Post
    Just to elaborate on my original post. My post on original panoptix 174 views - 0 replies. Post about livescope being expensive 4315 views- 41 replies.
    I guess market hype will always over rule actual experience.
    To me, it seems you were patting yourself on the back a little too much. How many views doesn't mean squat in my opinion. I viewed it and had no comment because I do not ice fish because that does not happen where I live. I do, on the other hand, use Livescope, which I think it awesome. The way I see it, use the tool that fits the job the best. Yes, some people are not going to look at the older tech because they want the latest greatest on the market. But that doesn't mean they are stuck up or living on "market hype". I've seen both in operation and for me, Livescope was by far the better choice.

  11. Member
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    #11
    The hype is real. Livescope is great. Glad you like your orginal Panoptix transducers. The degree of detail with Livescope makes a big difference for me.

  12. Member Astrochris's Avatar
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    #12
    I much prefer my PS22 and PS30 over the LS for my style of fishing, I fish deep for lake trout 50 to 120 feet. There is no need for me to see fish scales or eyeballs, I just need to know if they are there or not.
    A buddy has LS and IMO it's pretty much useless in water more than 60 feet, I certainly can see the advantages of LS for a bass fisherman who needs to see the fish hiding in brush or other structures, but for deep jigging the PS30 is hard to beat.

    Fish on!!
    C//
    8410XSV, 8612XSV
    GT15, GT40, PS30
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  13. Member
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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Astrochris View Post
    I much prefer my PS22 and PS30 over the LS for my style of fishing, I fish deep for lake trout 50 to 120 feet. There is no need for me to see fish scales or eyeballs, I just need to know if they are there or not.
    A buddy has LS and IMO it's pretty much useless in water more than 60 feet, I certainly can see the advantages of LS for a bass fisherman who needs to see the fish hiding in brush or other structures, but for deep jigging the PS30 is hard to beat.

    Fish on!!
    C//
    I have the PS30 and LVS32, and have been hitting Lake Superior Whitefish. Depths are 40-65'. At first I would use split screen with both on, but more and more I have been using just full screen LVS32. I can see the big lake trout plowing into those schools and scattering them , and pretty soon the school comes back in then more lakers plow into the school. I can tell the difference in the fish even at 60'. I can tell when it's a lake trout for sure. Next time out I'm rigging a deadstick with a big bucktail jig and a chunk of cut bait and we'll be catching more of those 30"+ fish. The whitefish they're eating are 8-14" fish. A lot of times I can even see the 3/8 oz. jig. With the ability to aim that transducer to find where the school has moved to I stay on them all day long. We catch fish all day long when the boats crowded around us just get frustrated. I though it would work good, but for what I'm doing it is unbelievable the difference it makes. I ain't ditching the PS30, I'm sure it will be much better at the 100'+ depths (Maybe), we'll see.

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    #14
    Quote Originally Posted by sra61 View Post
    I have the PS30 and LVS32, and have been hitting Lake Superior Whitefish. Depths are 40-65'. At first I would use split screen with both on, but more and more I have been using just full screen LVS32. I can see the big lake trout plowing into those schools and scattering them , and pretty soon the school comes back in then more lakers plow into the school. I can tell the difference in the fish even at 60'. I can tell when it's a lake trout for sure. Next time out I'm rigging a deadstick with a big bucktail jig and a chunk of cut bait and we'll be catching more of those 30"+ fish. The whitefish they're eating are 8-14" fish. A lot of times I can even see the 3/8 oz. jig. With the ability to aim that transducer to find where the school has moved to I stay on them all day long. We catch fish all day long when the boats crowded around us just get frustrated. I though it would work good, but for what I'm doing it is unbelievable the difference it makes. I ain't ditching the PS30, I'm sure it will be much better at the 100'+ depths (Maybe), we'll see.
    Can you record sonar with your unit? That would be really cool to see!

  15. Member
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    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by SamMule View Post
    Can you record sonar with your unit? That would be really cool to see!
    I don't think the 126 Ultra will record. I should have recorded it with my phone, but I was kind of mesmerized! I've seen it both times I was out. I will research the manual for record capability and if not I'll be sure to take time to at least record on my phone. I had about a 10-15lb. class fish chase one of the whitefish I caught! I caught a couple of whiteys that had been chewed on.
    RD slot fish sm.jpgMe & smoker sm..jpg

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    #16
    Wasn't my intent at all to be critical of those that choose livescope. My ice fishing site post intent was to alert others that panoptix can be affordable. Why do some people have to assume the worse of complete strangers ?

    As the Chinese say no good deed goes unpunished. I guess I should have not even bothered.
    Helix Mega 10 SI G2N , ILink
    Garmin 1040 XS / Garmin 1242 xsv with Panoptix Down VU PS 30 W/ GCV 10 networked with PS 31. Boat Rig

    Echomap Ultra 106 SV with Livescope 12 . Ice Rig

  17. Member
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    #17
    Quote Originally Posted by sra61 View Post
    I don't think the 126 Ultra will record. I should have recorded it with my phone, but I was kind of mesmerized! I've seen it both times I was out. I will research the manual for record capability and if not I'll be sure to take time to at least record on my phone. I had about a 10-15lb. class fish chase one of the whitefish I caught! I caught a couple of whiteys that had been chewed on.
    RD slot fish sm.jpgMe & smoker sm..jpg
    That first one looks like a slot fish! Hope you were on the south end!

  18. Member
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    #18
    Quote Originally Posted by SamMule View Post
    That first one looks like a slot fish! Hope you were on the south end!
    Slot fish, he swam away very healthy looking.

  19. Member
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    #19
    Quote Originally Posted by hays47 View Post
    Wasn't my intent at all to be critical of those that choose livescope. My ice fishing site post intent was to alert others that panoptix can be affordable.
    I didn't read it as critical. Your post was very clear that if LS was too expensive, the PS22 is a very good less expesive alternative. And I agree. I too have the PS22 ice fishing kit and love it on down view for ice fishing and see no need to use my LS for that. The PS22 is very good and was beneficial even before LS. I don't need it to look like a fish to know it is a fish.

    I now have the ice fishing PS22 on the boat which I put on an All Aboard Transducer pole in a stationary down view. My original PS22 is on the TM pole in a forward view, LS on the TM torpedo starboard side in forward view and a GT52 under the torpedo. I also have the PS30 on the transom so I have a pretty good down view around me with the PS22, PS30 and GT52 while using the TM PS22 and LS to scan. I tried the LS on the AAB transducer pole but didn't like having to constantly manually adjust it while also working the TM. Even on spotlock, I had to constantly adjust the LS pole as I am on a flowage and the boat is constantly moving. I tried several different set-up combinations and what I have now I really like and works good for me. I got off subject, but as you stated, the PS22 is a great less expensive alternative to live sonar if someone is not interested in dropping $1500 on a LS system.

  20. Member
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    #20
    Quote Originally Posted by hays47 View Post
    Wasn't my intent at all to be critical of those that choose livescope. My ice fishing site post intent was to alert others that panoptix can be affordable. Why do some people have to assume the worse of complete strangers ?

    As the Chinese say no good deed goes unpunished. I guess I should have not even bothered.
    When you post something as "hype", then you immediately are in criticizing mode. I think your post has merit, as not everyone can afford all the bells and whistles, so showing them a viable alternate is admirable. If you had spoken this post and we were there to hear it, most everyone would have received it as you intended. When you type something, no one can read tone and inflection, and the way you phrase a sentence will make it read differently to each person who might read it. So it is hard to purvey your ideas and intent without misinterpretation at times. And if you are directing the "assume the worst" comment towards me, I never once thought of you as a bad person. You were asking for a response since you did not get many, so I responded to how the post made me feel personally. For my style and type of fishing, Livescope is the best choice. Since I don't live in an area where ice fishing is part of the way we fish, maybe I should have not commented at all. But I felt you were asking for some sort of feedback, thus my post to your thread. No disrespect intended.

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