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  1. #1
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    Losing bottom signal over 15 MPH (Helix 7 MSI G3)

    So like the title says, any time the boat goes over 12-15 mph the unit loses bottom in 2D sonar and will read a really high number (1,000+ feet). Already updated to the latest software (1.94) and set max depth to 30 feet for water 15-25 feet deep per HBird suggestion. Problem persisted.

    I am quite certain it is a head unit issue. There is an old transducer on the other side of the transom (XNT 9 20T) that is compatible with the Helix 7. When connecting that transducer to the Helix 7, it does the same thing and loses bottom. If I hook it up to an old Humminbird head unit I have, the old unit is able to read and maintain the bottom signal fine. So it seems to be a head unit issue with the Helix 7.

    Any ideas on what might be going on?

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    #2
    Try turning the sensitivity down when you are reading bottom at high speed. The new units are much more sensitive than th old ones.

  3. Member Wayne P.'s Avatar
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    #3
    Post a picture of the transducer from a couple of angles.
    Wayne Purdum
    Charlottesville, Va.
    Helix 12 CHIRP MEGA+ SI G3N/G4N, Helix 15 CHIRP MEGA SI+ GPS G4N
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  5. Member Wayne P.'s Avatar
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    #5
    The height looks OK, the angle front to back needs tweaking for the best on plane depth performance. Lower the rear of the transducer one notch on the ratchets and see how it does.
    Wayne Purdum
    Charlottesville, Va.
    Helix 12 CHIRP MEGA+ SI G3N/G4N, Helix 15 CHIRP MEGA SI+ GPS G4N
    SOLIX 12 SI/G3, Helix 8 CHIRP MEGA SI+ G4N, Ultrex 80/LINK, MEGA360,
    MEGA LIVE, LIVE TL

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    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne P. View Post
    The height looks OK, the angle front to back needs tweaking for the best on plane depth performance. Lower the rear of the transducer one notch on the ratchets and see how it does.
    I can give that a try. Will it make the side imaging signal worse? The way it is currently setup was level to the lake bottom while at normal search speeds with side imaging of 3-6 mph. It was leveled using the level and stack of coins trick on the water and then replicated that at home on the trailer in order to get the transducer level how the boat sits in the water.

  7. Member Wayne P.'s Avatar
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    #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Pfunk View Post
    I can give that a try. Will it make the side imaging signal worse? The way it is currently setup was level to the lake bottom while at normal search speeds with side imaging of 3-6 mph. It was leveled using the level and stack of coins trick on the water and then replicated that at home on the trailer in order to get the transducer level how the boat sits in the water.
    You cannot have perfect images and high speed depth with the same transducer. You have to pick which performance you want as a priority.

    The alternative is to use a separate 2D transducer with Y cable to have both performance levels.
    Wayne Purdum
    Charlottesville, Va.
    Helix 12 CHIRP MEGA+ SI G3N/G4N, Helix 15 CHIRP MEGA SI+ GPS G4N
    SOLIX 12 SI/G3, Helix 8 CHIRP MEGA SI+ G4N, Ultrex 80/LINK, MEGA360,
    MEGA LIVE, LIVE TL

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    #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne P. View Post
    You cannot have perfect images and high speed depth with the same transducer. You have to pick which performance you want as a priority.

    The alternative is to use a separate 2D transducer with Y cable to have both performance levels.
    I already have a second 2D transducer on the boat which is an older one from a previous unit. When I hook that 2d transducer up to the Helix 7, I still have this problem. So I don’t see what good attaching it with a Y cable is going to do if it can’t perform while directly connected to the head unit?

    I’m not looking for any special performance out of the 2D sonar while on plane... just want to know the depth. We’re not talking 45 mph... we’re talking 17 foot aluminum boat with a 35 hp motor going 23 mph max. It’s just frustrating to spend $650 and not get a 2d sonar reading at 15 mph which is something we haven’t had a problem with in older units for years. I can’t imagine spending 2k and having this issue.

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    #9
    Lowering the back of the transducer a bit, like Wayne said, is the best advice. If that doesn't work, you could also try to raise the whole transducer a bit because it's on a board. I get good 2D reading with an aluminium boat at more than 50 mph.

    Also, why not use the old transducer and the old unit for 2D high speed reading and the Helix 7 for the rest.
    Last edited by Real L; 05-18-2019 at 12:55 PM.

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    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Real L View Post
    Also, why not use the old transducer and the old unit for 2D high speed reading and the Helix 7 for the rest.
    It’s my dad’s unit and boat and he is on a budget. He had rerouted the transducer cable from the old 2d transducer up to the bow because his plan was to move the Helix 7 head unit back and forth between the bow and the stern as needed whether he was trolling with the tiller motor or using the trolling motor and casting from the bow. The old unit has a very small screen and his old eyes would appreciate the larger screen on the bow when he is running the trolling motor and trying to see his nav chart. But if we can’t get this resolved he may have to just set up both units at the tiller like you’re saying.

  11. Member Wayne P.'s Avatar
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    #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Pfunk View Post
    I already have a second 2D transducer on the boat which is an older one from a previous unit. When I hook that 2d transducer up to the Helix 7, I still have this problem. So I don’t see what good attaching it with a Y cable is going to do if it can’t perform while directly connected to the head unit?

    I’m not looking for any special performance out of the 2D sonar while on plane... just want to know the depth. We’re not talking 45 mph... we’re talking 17 foot aluminum boat with a 35 hp motor going 23 mph max. It’s just frustrating to spend $650 and not get a 2d sonar reading at 15 mph which is something we haven’t had a problem with in older units for years. I can’t imagine spending 2k and having this issue.
    Did you change the G3 Connected Transducer setting to match the "old" transducer. No "old" units have HW CHIRP transducers.
    Wayne Purdum
    Charlottesville, Va.
    Helix 12 CHIRP MEGA+ SI G3N/G4N, Helix 15 CHIRP MEGA SI+ GPS G4N
    SOLIX 12 SI/G3, Helix 8 CHIRP MEGA SI+ G4N, Ultrex 80/LINK, MEGA360,
    MEGA LIVE, LIVE TL

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    #12
    We’ll give your suggestion of dropping the back down and see what that does to 2D and SI results. I’ll also try backing the sensitivity down. Thanks for the advice Wayne and Real L.

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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne P. View Post
    Did you change the G3 Connected Transducer setting to match the "old" transducer. No "old" units have HW CHIRP transducers.
    No Wayne, we did not do this. I guess I just assumed that if the XNT 9 20 T transducer was hard wired into the head unit that it would automatically “recognize” the connected transducer. It was showing a 2d sonar signal fine so I didn’t realize we had to tell the unit which transducer was connected. I will be sure to give this a try. Thanks for catching this!

  14. Member Wayne P.'s Avatar
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    #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Pfunk View Post
    No Wayne, we did not do this. I guess I just assumed that if the XNT 9 20 T transducer was hard wired into the head unit that it would automatically “recognize” the connected transducer. It was showing a 2d sonar signal fine so I didn’t realize we had to tell the unit which transducer was connected. I will be sure to give this a try. Thanks for catching this!
    Helix units do not have Auto Detect for transducer recognition. SOLIX does.
    Wayne Purdum
    Charlottesville, Va.
    Helix 12 CHIRP MEGA+ SI G3N/G4N, Helix 15 CHIRP MEGA SI+ GPS G4N
    SOLIX 12 SI/G3, Helix 8 CHIRP MEGA SI+ G4N, Ultrex 80/LINK, MEGA360,
    MEGA LIVE, LIVE TL

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    #15
    Got out this evening again after dropping the back edge of the transducer down one notch. It definitely helped some. Now it keeps an ok reading all the way up to top speed as long as the boat is heading in a straight line. Any turning and it loses it. Going to try lowering the transducer down 1/8 to 1/4 inch and give that a shot next time out.

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    #16
    I dont think you want to go any deeper. Id raise it a 1/8 to 1/4 inch. You dont want them plowing the water off the hull, or you will introduce more disruption to the water thats supposed to be flowing over the surface of the transducer.