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  1. #21
    I’m pretty sure the question was about side imaging.

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    #22
    So are you saying SI (including mega) doesn’t work well to show fishes close to sides/banks that have lots of rocks or concrete? Rock piles sit lots of fishes usually.


    Quote Originally Posted by LWINCHESTER2 View Post
    A lot of progress has been made in side imaging. And I have seen some spectacular shots on other boards clearly showing fish at distances greater than the depth against the background of the bottom. For my use though, on my lake, it is not nearly as effective as Panoptix and LiveScope. The thread I started "The death of side imaging" is something I predict will happen. I seriously believe that all it would take would be a 180 degree LiveScope.

    On my lake, three are not many places that provide the bland, monotonous bottom that make the fish the easiest to see. The banks are steep, rocky, and irregular. 90% of the fishing and catching occurs between the point where this incline meets the bottom and the bank. I am practically never looking out across a long flat. I'm looking against a rocky bank that sends strong bright returns. Turning down the settings in hopes of seeing a brighter fish return against a dim background is difficult. Looking for shadows of fish amongst shadows of irregular outcroppings is serious work. It can be done, but the whole idea of going fishing to have some fun is lost. The monochrome palettes are okay on overcast days but it's easy to miss targets that are displayed in bright sunlight especially when they are small due to using a wide scale.

    My most effective scanning is done using a combination of PS30 on the transom that shoots left and right and with the TM down and LiveScope pointed towards the bank. It's easy, simple and very effective. The fish are easy to see in any conditions and while a little experience will help, you don't have to go take a class to learn to interpret it.

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    #23
    You gentlemen are AWESOME! Lots of valuable information in this threa. Thank you so much!

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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by BassTracker175 View Post
    So are you saying SI (including mega) doesn’t work well to show fishes close to sides/banks that have lots of rocks or concrete? Rock piles sit lots of fishes usually.
    Doesn't work well??? Can't say I'd go that far. Not well enough for me, at least where I do my fishing. I've seen some pretty good screenshots of fish on SI that was not mega. The best ones had a common feature. It was a school or small school that presented a clear pattern against the irregular background. So it's not just as simple as a background of rocks or concrete. It's when they are so irregular that rocks between you and the fish get in the way. I don't mean rise to the surface but the distance to those rocks is less than the distance to those fish. The simpliest scenario is a sharp drop, then a ledge, then another sharp drop. Those fish on that ledge are difficult for SI to display. I've seen this repeatedly with crappie on bridge piers. We have some bridge piers that are stepped, large at the bottom, stepping in and rising again. I've gone by trying to see them on SI and may see one or two and maybe not see any. Then turn around with LiveScope and see them clustered on top of the step.

    We may be discussing this backwards. Lets reverse the logic. Describe a situation where SI will show you fish that won't show up as well or better on LiveScope.
    My wife asks if I'm going to fish every day. I can't fish every day. Some days I might be sick.

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    #25
    I think its safe to say that Livescope owns the water column. At least out to 100-125ft, anyway

    But might rotating 2 or 3 angled 2d xdcr's come close? just thinking out loud.

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    #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Brody View Post
    But might rotating 2 or 3 angled 2d xdcr's come close? just thinking out loud.
    No. I call this my redneck Panoptix. It's what I was doing before Panoptix came out. Really don't need it now, just haven't pulled it off the boat. It's better than nothing but no competition for Panoptix/LiveScope.
    My wife asks if I'm going to fish every day. I can't fish every day. Some days I might be sick.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Astrochris View Post
    SV mega just doesn’t work properly if the water isn’t calm, if you are not moving, if your fishing in more than 30 FOW
    To find fish on SV you have to be riveted to the screen because those fish or shadows are simply not obvious to see.

    Fish on!!
    C//
    All of that is incorrect.

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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by InternationalMarine Brian View Post
    All of that is incorrect.
    Really ? How well does SV work in choppy waters? How well does SV work when you’re not moving? How well does SV work in 100 feet of water? I’m talking about mega sv Where is the range is limited.

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    #29
    Considering this is bass boat central and most people here bass fish I can't tell you the last time I caught a bass in 100' of water. At least on the lakes I fish the deepest I caught a bass was in 35'. Side imaging doesn't work while sitting still. It's not intended to be used in that fashion. But at 3-5 MPH I can cover water quite well, even relatively choppy water. To me, it's more of a patterning tool than a fish finding tool. Yes, you may see the occasional fish on it, so long as they are not hugging the bottom or are balled up like bait. If I can determine the depth and type of cover the bass are relating to I can cover water 5x faster than using Panoptix/LiveScope.

    They're all tools. How you use them to your advantage is going to differ from person to person. What works more efficiently for you may not be the same as what works for someone else on any given body of water. Some people run'n'gun to find actively feeding fish, some people find fish and actively try to get them to feed. There is a difference.

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    #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Riccochet View Post
    They're all tools. How you use them to your advantage is going to differ from person to person. What works more efficiently for you may not be the same as what works for someone else on any given body of water. Some people run'n'gun to find actively feeding fish, some people find fish and actively try to get them to feed. There is a difference.
    So true. Most of my bass fishing is in deep water. On the same day I may see and catch spotted bass at 10-15 and at 80 ft. On Panoptix and LiveScope it is not unusual to see them move up or down 40-50 ft in seconds. I can cover water faster with PS30 but I still need SideVu. Quite often when searching I am watching the PS30, then when I see something then look on the SideVu for better detail to determine if its bait or fish. The adjustable cone of the PS30 allows for faster boat speed on the search but sacrifices the close to bottom look.

    We've gotten way off topic from the OP and that's my fault too. What was it----- Garmin UHD vs HB mega.
    My wife asks if I'm going to fish every day. I can't fish every day. Some days I might be sick.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Astrochris View Post
    Really ? How well does SV work in choppy waters? How well does SV work when you’re not moving? How well does SV work in 100 feet of water? I’m talking about mega sv Where is the range is limited.
    It works great in all of those situations. The images sitting still have to be interpreted of course. Not sure why you think deep water is an issue. Mega gen 1 does 120 ft a side. Mega + should be double that. That is not limited range. Most bass fisherman only need 80 ft a side depending on screen size. Any more than that and you’re not going to see small objects or fish. 455 will do several hundred feet or more with most manufacturers.

    the question was mega vs uhd. Not the limitations or benefits of side imaging.

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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by InternationalMarine Brian View Post
    It works great in all of those situations. The images sitting still have to be interpreted of course. Not sure why you think deep water is an issue. Mega gen 1 does 120 ft a side. Mega + should be double that. That is not limited range. Most bass fisherman only need 80 ft a side depending on screen size. Any more than that and you’re not going to see small objects or fish. 455 will do several hundred feet or more with most manufacturers.

    the question was mega vs uhd. Not the limitations or benefits of side imaging.
    I stand corrected.

    I have never been able to get useful SV images while the boat is pitching and rolling in rough waters.
    Usable SV images while the boat is not moving,,, that is a bold statement.

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    #33
    I guess in this situation, boat needs to be moving fast to get good SI images, faster than normal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Astrochris View Post
    I stand corrected.

    I have never been able to get useful SV images while the boat is pitching and rolling in rough waters.
    Usable SV images while the boat is not moving,,, that is a bold statement.

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    #34
    While sitting still any fish which move through the beam stand out like the proverbials. In fact better than a boat moving
    John

    Solix 12, Helix 12, Onix 10

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    #35
    agree. I had the orginal panoptix and loved it as well. Not sure why it took everyone so long to realize how it was better seeing live. I don't agree with the people saying you can't find structure with livescope. I think it just depends if you want to fish and look for structure or you want to drive your boat around for hours looking for structure. I fish and look around for structure, then I know exactly where it is and how far. trolling motor is pointed at it and you can drive right too it without stopping and dropping the trolling motor. Finding your waypoint and then zigzagging around trying to find it on 2d, which means you have drove over the top of it and spooked fish. If you had livescope you would know the fish you see on your 2d/down imaging are already gone now because you spooked them trying to find the structure you wanted to fish.

    It really depends on how and where you fish though. So each to their own.

    Quote Originally Posted by hays47 View Post
    I really have no bias when it comes to my MFD. BUT right now Garmin has become my choice for the way I fish. I do run both Humminbird and Garmin. However I rarely turn the Helix 10 G2 Mega on any more. why ?

    Due to my 71year old vision. I really have to limit the range on the sideview to notice fish images. Even then it still is a 50/50 proposition that what I saw was fish. On the Panoptix PS 21 and PS 30 on my boat there is no doubt. If it is moving they are fish. It is to me the most efficient search machine for fish. The PS 22 is all I need when on the ice.

    What still amazes me is. It took Livescope Panoptix to get a large number of anglers excited. The original Panoptix got me all fired up. Somebody used the analogy that if you were searching for something. In a dark room. Would you use a flashlight or turn on the overhead lights ? Yes the difference is that big.

    I have stated on here several times. Once someone sees Panoptix in action, by someone who knows how to use it , they immediately see its value. What is funny the biggest doubters become the biggest fans. On the other hand my 360 View impressed almost no one. Evidently I didn't know how to use that.

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    #36
    I have garmin 1242 and 942 units with the Ultra HD sonar module. Excluding livescope which I have not seen this is my personal opinion on the ultra high def imaging vs mega. I fished with my cousin a few weeks ago who has helix 10s with the mega imaging and I fished with my garmin the weekend after. The mega imaging is far superior than the garmin ultra hd. The hummingbird was very crisp and clear. You can easily see the shadows from structure on the hummingbird compared with my garmin. The garmin you can still make out stumps and rocks but is a bit blurry. That being said I also have limited time on the garmin with adjusting the settings. With that being said, I'm sure once I upgrade to livescope the garmin will be the better option to have.

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    #37
    I wanted the 'bird Mega+ SI to complement my Garmin LS. After reading all the issue folks have with 'bird SW updates on multiple forums - no way am I buying one. I'll make do with the Garmin until Humminbird gets their SW QC/QA up to modern standards.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by jawjatek View Post
    I wanted the 'bird Mega+ SI to complement my Garmin LS. After reading all the issue folks have with 'bird SW updates on multiple forums - no way am I buying one. I'll make do with the Garmin until Humminbird gets their SW QC/QA up to modern standards.
    I run Lowrance at the wheel because I really have gotten used to/like their side and down imaging. Garmin at the bow for my 2D and Livescope. It allows me to find the structure at the wheel and dissect it with the livescope at the bow.

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    #39
    Mega looks awesome, too many guys having troubles on their boards for my liking. If you have to do a song and dance to use it I'll go elsewhere.

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    #40


    shadows are your friend,I have seen more fishn on my garmins than anything else I have owned.
    Last edited by TOUCH OF CLASS; 04-16-2019 at 11:38 AM.

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