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  1. #1
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    Handling while on the pad

    Hey all, possibly a novice question here, if not then mods feel free to move to the appropriate section.

    I've owned many boats, mostly for hunting than boating and fishing. All have been aluminum including my current Lowe 170. None until now have had the "power" or were designed to get onto the pad. Not than I have a ton of power now with my 70hp Yamaha but plenty get it up on the pad.

    Having said all that, how should the boat handle while on pad? Should I expect it to turn well? What I've noticed is once on pad I loose the ability to turn hard or bank into turns. I don't know if this is normal operation, characteristics of my specific boat or aluminum boats in general, or this is not normal at all. When I turn it will slowly point the bow in the desired direction but when I push the turn harder all of a sudden it "catches" and bites hard and nearly throws you from the boat. Maybe this is the water chines catching or it coming off of the pad and it catches???

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  3. Member Fatshaft Merc's Avatar
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    #2
    You should trim down, get some boat in the water, then turn. Trying to turn more than a veer on pad can be nasty if it blows out.
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    '80 hydra-sport sx178 w/175 XRI

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    #3
    I don't think a Lowe 170 has a pad. I think it is just a typical flat bottom. A boat with A pad will generally take at least 50 mph to have the chines out of the water. It will likely be above 60. When truly running up on the pad you will not be able to do much turning. You will also start getting some chine walk which will require some balancing with steering inputs.

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    #4
    Quote Originally Posted by gehol View Post
    I don't think a Lowe 170 has a pad. I think it is just a typical flat bottom. A boat with A pad will generally take at least 50 mph to have the chines out of the water. It will likely be above 60. When truly running up on the pad you will not be able to do much turning. You will also start getting some chine walk which will require some balancing with steering inputs.
    Thats what is happening. It does have a pad. It’s not really a flat bottom but a mod V with a stepped chine a foot in front of the transom. You definitely know that it’s on the pad cuz of the way it steers. The way I’ve read it's not necessarily speed that gets you on pad but also the weight of the hull. I could see on a heavier glass boat it would take more speed but you can feel the lift on my boat anything over 32mph when trimmed correct.

    Thanks for all the info. If figured either trim down to get some hull in the water or slow a bit.

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    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Podcast View Post
    Thats what is happening. It does have a pad. It’s not really a flat bottom but a mod V with a stepped chine a foot in front of the transom. You definitely know that it’s on the pad cuz of the way it steers. The way I’ve read it's not necessarily speed that gets you on pad but also the weight of the hull. I could see on a heavier glass boat it would take more speed but you can feel the lift on my boat anything over 32mph when trimmed correct.

    Thanks for all the info. If figured either trim down to get some hull in the water or slow a bit.
    Not going to argue with you but, I have looked all over two Lowe websites and can not find any mention or any picture showing a pad on their 170/175 series boat. But, as you pointed out Lowes does make a mod V. Respectfully you may not know what a pad is on a boat. It is a very specific feature of high performance hulls. If you get a chance look under a bass boat and I think you will be able to see what a pad looks like.

    https://www.loweboats.com/blog/wp-co...-Fishboats.pdf
    https://www.loweboats.com/aluminum-boat-construction/

    The links below show some pictures of a pad on both a tin boat and a glass boat.

    https://scout.com/outdoors/bass-fish...ress-105347566
    www.bbcboards.net/showthread.php?t=752873

    Let me add that you MIGHT be confusing "on plane" with "on pad". My particular boat will plane at speeds under 30 MPH. However, it will not get completely on pad (as in nothing but the pad touching the water, chines clear of the water) until around 60 mph, depending on how much load is in the boat. Also on a Bullet for example the outside edge of the pad actually curves down a little producing additional lift.
    Last edited by gehol; 06-10-2018 at 11:05 PM.

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    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by gehol View Post
    Not going to argue with you but, I have looked all over two Lowe websites and can not find any mention or any picture showing a pad on their 170/175 series boat. But, as you pointed out Lowes does make a mod V. Respectfully you may not know what a pad is on a boat. It is a very specific feature of high performance hulls. If you get a chance look under a bass boat and I think you will be able to see what a pad looks like.

    https://www.loweboats.com/blog/wp-co...-Fishboats.pdf
    https://www.loweboats.com/aluminum-boat-construction/

    The links below show some pictures of a pad on both a tin boat and a glass boat.

    https://scout.com/outdoors/bass-fish...ress-105347566
    www.bbcboards.net/showthread.php?t=752873

    Let me add that you MIGHT be confusing "on plane" with "on pad". My particular boat will plane at speeds under 30 MPH. However, it will not get completely on pad (as in nothing but the pad touching the water, chines clear of the water) until around 60 mph, depending on how much load is in the boat. Also on a Bullet for example the outside edge of the pad actually curves down a little producing additional lift.
    I take no offense at anything you've said. I can say I'm not confusing on plane with on the pad though. The boat gets on plane at a very low speed, under 20mph, more accurately around 17-18mph the bow "snaps" down into position. Everything from there is just added speed up to 40mph where it tops out. Anything over 32mph and the hull creates enough lift when the motor is trimmed correctly to make steering dangerous when doing anything more than "veering" whether or not it actually has a physical pad is irrelevant. My question still remains, is this normal operation and what's the best way to "deal" with it(the latter seems to have been answered in a prior post unless there's other options).

    Edit: I do want to point out that the hull of the Lowe is stepped to the transom. I cannot find an online pic of it but the bottom of the hull ends a good foot or more before the transom starts. Where it ends it rises a few inches to a flat surface that connects to the transom. I cannot find any info on this hull or the reason for it's design.
    Last edited by Podcast; 06-11-2018 at 09:56 AM.

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    #7
    It is normal for a boat with a pad when on the pad. So if you are talking about a boat with a pad, then having a pad or not is relevant. A boat with a pad, will have one answer and without, another answer. Honestly a V hull I am not sure. My gut tells me a v hull should be able to turn pretty well at most any speed. It should, IMO, grab the water with the "V" and just lean into the turn. But, and I emphasize I am not sure, as I have never run a "V" type hull. Go over to "Scream and Fly" and ask that question. A lot of them run very fast "V" type hulls and they are some very sharp people over there. I will bet somebody over there will have a definitive answer and can explain it.

  9. Member croix-man's Avatar
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    #8
    In the late 90's and early 2000's up to about 2006 ish Lowe built a 160 W , 170 W , and 180 W. These boats are all built on pad hulls. You don't see much info on them or very many used ones. People tend to keep them. Also Lowe built a mod v version of the same boat. I had a 2002 Lowe 180 W for about 5 years . What you are noticing in the sudden grab is when the rakes catch while turning. You just need to back down a little before making a hard turn

  10. Member croix-man's Avatar
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    #9
    https://cms.geteminleads.com/files/8...-Fishboats.pdf

    I stand corrected! My mistake gents. Here is the catalog with all the info from 2002. It was some type of pro trac mod v setup.

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    #10
    As you can see Croix, no pad. I know the OP thought I was just busting his chops but, I did not intend to. He asked a specific question about high speed handling of a boat on pad. There is a specific answer. Yes, when a boat is up on the pad you can not do much if any turning. When up on the pad, you will be busy balancing the boat on the pad with minute corrections. If you let it fall off to one side you will have a very exciting ride and you might even get wet. So the original question was how does a boat handle when on pad? Honest question, with a relatively easy answer as stated above. The problem for the OP is he did not know or understand his boat does not have a pad and if it did (like an Express) it would not be able to get up on the pad anywhere near the speeds he is talking about. The OP has a legitimate question that I hope he gets the answer to. He just did not know how to ask it.
    I wish I had the answer for his boat but, as I stated I just don't know for sure and so far nobody else has given an answer.

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    #11
    Thanks to all. I do not believe that you were busting my chops, I simply used the incorrect verbiage of pad instead of on plane. I will check the motor placement and other measurements mentioned in my other thread and ensure all is setup correctly. I just bought this boat last fall and have used it only a handful of times. So far it's great and gets good speed as well as excellent fish"ability".

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    #12
    Hey I run a Lowe 170, it is a 2010 with a Merc 75 Hp 2 stroke outboard. I believe you are over trimming it a bit. If you can not dig into a turn and steer that hull going over 1/2 throttle you need to look at your setup. Are you porpoising at full throttle. What prop are you running, specs wise, and what rpm are you getting to at full throttler. I run a lot of rough water here on the big open water of the Chesapeake Bay and its rivers.

    I chose to help all of the handling by installing a Sting Ray hydrofoil. I also choose not to run a stainless prop so I chose a performance aluminum Hustler prop made by Turning Point. It is built like a lot of performance stainless props with vent holes and sharp ears with plenty of cup in it. I run a 3 blade and tested 2 different props. Afterwards I chose the one that ran the boat best but had my local prop shop do a little custom massaging of it. If I want to make a fast turn all I have to do is barely jog the trim button down for a second, sorta just a quick snap of my thumb and I am good to go. As it is set up I get about 37 mph with a FULL tournament load of gear, a full tank of fuel and two people. This is not the fastest 17 1/2 foot aluminum bass boat out there, but it rides a lot smoother than some of the others.

    Here are some pics to look at.

    https://imageshack.com/i/poGHv94lj

    https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/6...924/r16fU3.jpg
    Last edited by fishnkamp; 06-13-2018 at 08:38 PM. Reason: my pictures did not load

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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by fishnkamp View Post
    Hey I run a Lowe 170, it is a 2010 with a Merc 75 Hp 2 stroke outboard. I believe you are over trimming it a bit. If you can not dig into a turn and steer that hull going over 1/2 throttle you need to look at your setup. Are you porpoising at full throttle. What prop are you running, specs wise, and what rpm are you getting to at full throttler. I run a lot of rough water here on the big open water of the Chesapeake Bay and its rivers.

    I chose to help all of the handling by installing a Sting Ray hydrofoil. I also choose not to run a stainless prop so I chose a performance aluminum Hustler prop made by Turning Point. It is built like a lot of performance stainless props with vent holes and sharp ears with plenty of cup in it. I run a 3 blade and tested 2 different props. Afterwards I chose the one that ran the boat best but had my local prop shop do a little custom massaging of it. If I want to make a fast turn all I have to do is barely jog the trim button down for a second, sorta just a quick snap of my thumb and I am good to go. As it is set up I get about 37 mph with a FULL tournament load of gear, a full tank of fuel and two people. This is not the fastest 17 1/2 foot aluminum bass boat out there, but it rides a lot smoother than some of the others.

    Here are some pics to look at.

    https://imageshack.com/i/poGHv94lj

    https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/6...924/r16fU3.jpg
    Thanks for your input. I have a hydrofoil on the motor and do not get any porpoising UNLESS I trim up too far. There is a "sweet spot" just between the porpoising and when the trim starts to push my bow down causing a noticeable resistance or drag. In my mind this is the "perfect" spot since my RPMS are right around 5,600 and the boat rides really nicely although this is also the trim spot that if I push the boat into a corner it will all of a sudden grab and want to throw you over the side. I can still veer left and right when trimmed in this position but I cannot push the boat into a banked corner, I would have to trim down to do so which causes the drag. Maybe according to what you have to do this is normal???

    I run a 13x19 aluminum prop and I am considering going to a 13x17 since my Yamaha 2 stroke can run at 6k wide open. With my current 13x19 prop I am running just under 40mph @ 5,600 RPM with a full tourney load. Once I trim down to corner better I will drop a couple mph and loose the corresponding RPMS. I don't necessarily "need' to go to the 17 pitch but it would be nice when pulling my kids on the tube and shouldn't have an issue of over spinning the motor running solo with just me and my gear.

    I checked last night and my motor is setup according to what was recommended in the original thread: cav plate is sitting at the top of the drain hole etc.

  15. Member Fatshaft Merc's Avatar
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    #14
    Get rid of the aluminum prop. They will slip terribly and blow out in turns. That is 90% or your issues. Get a stainless steel 17p, it'll drive like a different boat.
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    '80 hydra-sport sx178 w/175 XRI

  16. Member Fishysam's Avatar
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    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by croix-man View Post
    https://cms.geteminleads.com/files/8...-Fishboats.pdf

    I stand corrected! My mistake gents. Here is the catalog with all the info from 2002. It was some type of pro trac mod v setup.
    i know more about a 2002 lowe, than any crestliner! and i tried to find info on crestliners.... i also think lowes 2002 catalog is more useful than most current manufactures
    Mercury 250 proxs 2B115089

  17. Member Midnight Rider's Avatar
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    #16
    What you are describing is normal for almost any boat. A true pad boat will turn very little at WOT, and in fact it can be dangerous to do so, as the boat will fall off the pad and CAN hook on you. That can mean a quick exit and swim. If you are making a hard turn, there is no option other than to trim it down a bit to allow the hull to utilize the chines to help turn it. My BassCat Sabre will turn so quickly that I have to be on top of it to avoid a swim. Yes, trimming down cause more hull drag, but there's really no option if you want to stay safe.
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