Fish Reveal ??

[hays47]

I gave up on Lowrance so far back . I cannot remember the year. Yet I must give them a compliment on the idea of the fish reveal. As our population ages anything that aids lesser vision. Helps greatly in locating fish. While it only works in the DI mode , SI mode cannot be that far ahead.

Over the years one of the common complaints of all SI and DI images is the difficulty in identifying fish.Especially us anglers that are getting on in years. Hopefully Garmin and the other companies come out with something similar.

That was why Panoptix won me over so quickly. Eliminated the guessing when trying to use DI and SI to find fish. I understand that they are great structure finding tools. But I can't fillet and fry structure.

[ifishinxs]

You summed that up pretty well.

[puhlw]

Is this any different than just setting the graph to show the little fishy symbols instead of archs? Either way the software needs to interpret the signal and make a decision if it thinks its a fish or not. Either it colors it, or changes the shape.

With that said I this option better than the oversized fish icon option.

[LWINCHESTER2]

It will take some time to tell. Just like the fish symbols that show up for air bubbles and tree limbs the test will be just how well the software can discriminate between just something that is not the bottom and something that is a fish. Not saying they can't or don't do it but if they do it well it will be a hit. At this point I would tend to think it is more fluff than substance. It is a free software upgrade - right? If one of the companies actually could discriminate object densitity well enough to be accurate and reliable is separating fish from air bubbles, limbs, etc. I would expect that this would be a complete generational advance and they would require you to buy all new equipment to get such a feature. And we would!!!

I do expect that it will happen. All the research and advancements in the medical field with echocardiograms, sonograms, and ultrasound seems to say that better marine sonar imaging might be possible.

[Wayne P.]

It will take some time to tell. Just like the fish symbols that show up for air bubbles and tree limbs the test will be just how well the software can discriminate between just something that is not the bottom and something that is a fish. Not saying they can't or don't do it but if they do it well it will be a hit. At this point I would tend to think it is more fluff than substance. It is a free software upgrade - right? If one of the companies actually could discriminate object densitity well enough to be accurate and reliable is separating fish from air bubbles, limbs, etc. I would expect that this would be a complete generational advance and they would require you to buy all new equipment to get such a feature. And we would!!!

I do expect that it will happen. All the research and advancements in the medical field with echocardiograms, sonograms, and ultrasound seems to say that better marine sonar imaging might be possible.

Humminbird has been doing the FishID thing for many years.

This shows three bass in a laydown tree. The tree parts are not represented with symbols, just the bass are:

[fishin couillon]

When Lowrance came out with their 1st Structure Scan system (LSS 1) it had the downscan overlay. That is where downscan image can be overlaid on the sonar screen so you can better identify what you were looking at. It is still part of the program as of today. I can count on 1 hand how many times i used that option. Not cause i dont like it just cause i dont have any use for it, i always do split screens. Now i'm no expert and IN MY OPINION Fish Reveal is just the opposite of the downscan overlay. They overlay the sonar returns onto the down scan image. And yes there is some software changes to make that happen but the same......we were taught that the sonar has a "cone" that give the return and imaging is a "slice". So they didnt turn the imaging into a "cone" to get those fish archs, its just an overlay.

I still have HDS units on my boat but have not had a chance to try out the new update.

[LWINCHESTER2]

I have to admit that it's been years since I used fish symbols of any brand. My opinion is tainted with that experience. I'm glad to see that improvements are being made in this area. Some of the best areas that I walleye fish have constant streams of air bubbles. Using fish symbols of any brand, in the past, was very confusing in these areas. It would look like there were zillions of fish. Panopitx helps the most as a vertical column of air, even though it shows up, is easy to see as a constant rising column of bubbles and if fish are nearby they can still be seen separate from it. It's not fish symbols but it's quite easy to separate the rising column from horizontal movement or something else stationary. Side imaging does an adequate job in these areas as the rising columns will be horizontal lines and so can be ignored.

[hays47]

Wayne I see them on any makers 2d. On the down imaging is what I was referring to . Which by the way I don't see the fish on your Side and Down views.

Have no problems with the 2D of the fish ID accuracy varies greatly depending on model and make. 2D has very limited range as opposed to the down and side scans. I would hope Garmin ( my personal favorite ) would come out with something similar.

My dream would be see them on si and di views. Then pinpoint them using Panoptix. I critiqued Garmin going down the MEGA path that Humminbird has already emblazoned. While important to some not to me. What do I care about counting the whiskers on a catfishes chin ? I just want to know is he there or not. To some just knowing a tire reef is there is enough. Others may want to be able to read the brand name on the tires. Exaggerated of course but only slightly.

I will not buy a Lowrance regardless of what they come up with. But just like the idea of something that at a glance alerts user to fish being present in area being searched. As others have mentioned if it is nothing but fluff. It will soon be found out. I had one MFD that would display fish no matter where it was. Even on dry land. That came off the boat PDQ.

[Wayne P.]

Wayne I see them on any makers 2d. On the down imaging is what I was referring to . Which by the way I don't see the fish on your Side and Down views.

Have no problems with the 2D of the fish ID accuracy varies greatly depending on model and make. 2D has very limited range as opposed to the down and side scans. I would hope Garmin ( my personal favorite ) would come out with something similar.

My dream would be see them on si and di views. Then pinpoint them using Panoptix. I critiqued Garmin going down the MEGA path that Humminbird has already emblazoned. While important to some not to me. What do I care about counting the whiskers on a catfishes chin ? I just want to know is he there or not. To some just knowing a tire reef is there is enough. Others may want to be able to read the brand name on the tires. Exaggerated of course but only slightly.

I will not buy a Lowrance regardless of what they come up with. But just like the idea of something that at a glance alerts user to fish being present in area being searched. As others have mentioned if it is nothing but fluff. It will soon be found out. I had one MFD that would display fish no matter where it was. Even on dry land. That came off the boat PDQ.

I do since I know what they look like in cover. Just need to be familiar with your electronics.

Humminbird filters the returns based on air bladder sizes. Takes at least a 1# bass to get the smallest symbol of the three sizes.
No "fuff"with Humminbird, it is a fishing tool.

This is the same tree a few days earlier than the above screen shot. I did not see any symbols so I did not stop to fish it.
I scanned that tree four days ago and no symbols so I did not waste my time fishing there.

[LWINCHESTER2]

Wayne. Maybe you just had fish symbols turned off. Just kidding. I too find it very useful to check the same areas repeatedly and look at the differences.

This whole air bladder thing is a mystery to me. I'm not disputing it. It just doesn't add up to me. Here is why:
1. I use Rapala jigging raps and hard solid spoons walleye fishing. They show up real well regardless of brand of electronics. No air involved. Here's the rub. The sonar return is caused by a difference in density, but apparently it doesn't matter whether that difference is plus or minus. A fish that approaches one of my lures at 100 ft and the lure, when both are in the center of the cone look just alike.
2. The comparison testing I did with the PS21 and PS31 was using walleye that did not have an air bladder. I know because I caught them very deep and if the bladder wasn't ruptured, I ruptured it. I could see these fish 160 ft away 100 ft deep. It is said that the density of a fish is very near the density of water. So I don't have an explanation of why I could see these fish. If the density discrimination was sensitive enough to show them, it seems the same technology applied to seeing fish on the bottom would be better than it is. And only leaves to question how far away I could have seen them if they had an air bladder.

[fischbear]

FishID is partially pointless for experienced anglers. It adds very little info. Most fish are clear on DS already. However, I've always wondered, why no company did this regularly before. It's so simple! It's just a weighted and thresholded overlay. That's no calculation effort at all. Maybe they do a spatial filtering for arch shapes, but already the simple overlay would have been nice.
And this brings me to the second point, why it's not totally pointless. It allows to ditch one of the screens and frees the screen real estate and that would already achieved by a simple weighted overlay.

For sidescan, the fish ID has existed for a long time! It's called StructureScan 3D and friends.
From non-interferometric side scan it's impossible to ID fish anywhere else that in the water column part. There is no way of telling whether a return is a rock or a fish, since the depth information is missing.

[LWINCHESTER2]

.......For sidescan, the fish ID has existed for a long time! It's called StructureScan 3D and friends.
From non-interferometric side scan it's impossible to ID fish anywhere else that in the water column part. There is no way of telling whether a return is a rock or a fish, since the depth information is missing.

And this is why the Panoptix PS30 is so valuable to me. One glance, range and depth both instantly recognizable and I don't have to squint or zoom.

Also thanks to Wayne for the screenshots he sent to me. FishId/Symbols looks like it has come along way.

[hays47]

http://www.crappie.com/crappie/fishi...g-fish-reveal/

Looks like more than fluff according to this user.

[kry29]

Is this any different than just setting the graph to show the little fishy symbols instead of archs? Either way the software needs to interpret the signal and make a decision if it thinks its a fish or not. Either it colors it, or changes the shape.

With that said I this option better than the oversized fish icon option.

I think it's basically the same thing as fish Id.

[redneckcobra]

I updates software and tried the "fish reveal" this weekend. I like it. Gives you defined arches on DI.

Another gadget, but it does work.