Why not more Talons on fishing tour?

[mastergun]

Curious what thoughts are on why there aren't more Talons on the professional fishing tour especially with the difference in anchoring depth between the two with PP max at 10' and Talon previously at 12' but now at 15'? While I have no experience with PP I'm I have a single 12" Talon and am looking to add a 2nd but am also considering PowerPoles instead. Is weight that much of a huge factor or does PowerPole just simply sponsor (provide free PowerPoles) to more pros?

I have a Tracker 190TX and the one thing that is pushing me away from PP is lack of space for the pumps.

Thanks.

[javjoe]

Actually a few pro's have switched to Talons this year, KVD was one of them. Strangely they are all going with the new 8 footer!

[Wayne P.]

Actually a few pro's have switched to Talons this year, KVD was one of them. Strangely they are all going with the new 8 footer!

Do not need a longer Talon when using the Ultrex.

[Randy T]

Money and setup/rigging. Weight is not the main factor for a pro. They have more gear than ever needed in their boats.

The question is how often do you anchor in more than 9.5 feet of water?

[JR19]

You see lots of Ranger, Nitro, Skeeter and Trition on both pro tours. Yet a lot of people think Allison is one of the best hand crafted boats and is among the fastest boat made. One would think high quality and speed are very important to a person who fishes for a living but yet Allison is almost non-existent on both tours. I just used Allison as one example but I could name several other boats that are capable or even in some cases more capable than whats most popular on both tours. Does this make any of them superior or inferior? No it means marketing,advertising and contingency money is not being spent on either tour. FLW pays a 25,000 bonus for running a Ranger if you win. Let them make that bonus $ for having Talons and you will see used Power Poles for sale at an epic pace.

[KandKKustomz]

You see lots of Ranger, Nitro, Skeeter and Trition on both pro tours. Yet a lot of people think Allison is one of the best hand crafted boats and is among the fastest boat made. One would think high quality and speed are very important to a person who fishes for a living but yet Allison is almost non-existent on both tours. I just used Allison as one example but I could name several other boats that are capable or even in some cases more capable than whats most popular on both tours. Does this make any of them superior or inferior? No it means marketing,advertising and contingency money is not being spent on either tour. FLW pays a 25,000 bonus for running a Ranger if you win. Let them make that bonus $ for having Talons and you will see used Power Poles for sale at an epic pace.

While Allison is the lambo of bassboats so to speak.. I believe you don't see them on tour as most people would agree (and even allison owners) that while they are high quality and fast, from a fishing standpoint there are not the most stable fishing platforms out there, from a hot rod standpoint there one of the best yes, but from a pure fishing standpoint there not. I do agree if there was a $25,000 contingency bonus for winning and having talons then yes more would be running them. Maybe paying Brandon and Kevin all that $$ to use a set on the back of there boats will pay off for them.. maybe not...I don't see however without something like that you will ever see the 90% Power Pole 10% talon split ever reverse in Minn Kota's favor on the elite series. IMO the ones that are running them choose 8 due to the weight and the lack of need, as people have stated for anything over 8 foot having the ultrex. Shallow water anchors are supposed to be that..shallow..to me anything over 10 foot is pushing the word shallow.

[kry29]

Captains cash and contingency money

[Allison225]

While Allison is the lambo of bassboats so to speak.. I believe you don't see them on tour as most people would agree (and even allison owners) that while they are high quality and fast, from a fishing standpoint there are not the most stable fishing platforms out there, from a hot rod standpoint there one of the best yes, but from a pure fishing standpoint there not. I do agree if there was a $25,000 contingency bonus for winning and having talons then yes more would be running them. Maybe paying Brandon and Kevin all that $$ to use a set on the back of there boats will pay off for them.. maybe not...I don't see however without something like that you will ever see the 90% Power Pole 10% talon split ever reverse in Minn Kota's favor on the elite series. IMO the ones that are running them choose 8 due to the weight and the lack of need, as people have stated for anything over 8 foot having the ultrex. Shallow water anchors are supposed to be that..shallow..to me anything over 10 foot is pushing the word shallow.

I guess you have never fished out of a 21ft Allison to make a statement about it not being a very stabel fishing platform

[KandKKustomz]

Not knocking Allison's at all simply going by what I have heard from many Allison owners ive done work for when ive asked about how they like them. Thats the number one response..fast, but there are
much more stable boats out there.

[DixieChicken]

Money and setup/rigging. Weight is not the main factor for a pro.

Bazinga!

It's about who's paying who.

Mark Martin walked around with Viagra on his uniform, jackets, cars, shirts, and everything else forever. Can't say I'd do that!

The question is how often do you anchor in more than 9.5 feet of water?

Funny you mention that. Seems the idea of "shallow water" has now turned into DEEP WATER. I was talking with a board sponsor, Talon/Power Pole dealer last week about just that. I've been fine so far with a single 8' pole, although this week I'm planning on making the move to dual's, probably Blade 10's.

They have more gear than ever needed in their boats.

THEY have?
You've not seen my boat, right?

The weight issue is valid though, although with the pro's they really don't care, as long as nobody is fishing in "their spot" when they get there.
(Or they better move!)

OTOH.... Several dealers have brought up that the Talons, a single 10' Talon (with that snazzy $300 bracket) weighs as much as a PAIR of 8' Power Poles.
That's HUGE! But hey, they have little blinking lights, and a forward firing 'white' light to help you see at night.

[Randy T]

Funny you mention that. Seems the idea of "shallow water" has now turned into DEEP WATER. I was talking with a board sponsor, Talon/Power Pole dealer last week about just that. I've been fine so far with a single 8' pole, although this week I'm planning on making the move to dual's, probably Blade 10's.

So in an attempt to poke at MK for exceeding "shallow water" you also claim that 8' is also not enough.
I asked this question because one 12' Talon will hold where no PP can regardless of the amount installed on the boat.

THEY have? You've not seen my boat, right?

The weight issue is valid though, although with the pro's they really don't care, as long as nobody is fishing in "their spot" when they get there.
(Or they better move!)

OTOH.... Several dealers have brought up that the Talons, a single 10' Talon (with that snazzy $300 bracket) weighs as much as a PAIR of 8' Power Poles.

That's HUGE! But hey, they have little blinking lights, and a forward firing 'white' light to help you see at night.

If weight is such an issue, then why do the pros run Rudes (30lbs heavier), Suzukis (70lbs heavier), and Verados (130lbs heavier) than either SHO or ProXS? Not all of them run lithium batteries either. 8' Sportsmans weight as must a single 10, but a single 10 is less than 2 8' Blades (what the pros run). Each lengths is a 40lb difference, which is no big deal with the current market heading to 4 strokes and the Torque output of the G2 hole shot problems are solved which is where that weight difference is most noticeable. BTW only one dealer uses Talons weight as poor excuse to persuade buyers into PPs.

Nice try though

[DixieChicken]

So in an attempt to poke at MK for exceeding "shallow water" you also claim that 8' is also not enough.

I asked this question because one 12' Talon will hold where no PP can regardless of the amount installed on the boat.

Randy, No.... that is NOT what I said. I'm not POKING at MK. I never said "Having a 8' (shallow water anchor from any brand) is not enough".

What I *said* was: "I've been fine so far with a single 8' pole, although this week I'm planning on making the move to dual's, probably Blade 10's."
It's not that I actually NEED a 10' unit, but for ONLY $200 over 8' units..... then why not.
FWIW, None of us NEED a bass boat.

If weight is such an issue, then why do the pros run Rudes (30lbs heavier), Suzukis (70lbs heavier), and Verados (130lbs heavier) than either SHO or ProXS? Not all of them run lithium batteries either...... which is no big deal with the current market heading to 4 strokes and the Torque output of the G2 hole shot problems are solved which is where that weight difference is most noticeable. BTW only one dealer uses Talons weight as poor excuse to persuade buyers into PPs.

Nice try though

I also agreed that weight isn't really an issue with the pro's
when I said "although with the pro's they really don't care, as long as nobody is fishing in "their spot" when they get there".

The truth however is weight IS AN ISSUE with pretty much everyone else.

Why do they run Evinrude G2's? Seriously??? You know how fast those darned things are, guessing that might play into it juuuuuust a bit.As far as the power plant they are running, again.... money talks. But if I were a pro, and was running a new boat like they do, and could get any sort of discount on a G2, I'd have that puppy IN A MINUTE!
(Try to find a used one for sale on any make bass boat and you have to open the search literally nationwide. Last search I did on Boat Trader there were a total of FOUR in the entire country.)

Not all of them might run lithiums, but you can bet a LOT do! Especially when they can put a sticker on the boat, or a logo on their jerseys! Heck, I've about got my wife talked into them, and by the time my current batteries go belly up (which shouldn't be anytime soon) that may indeed be the direction I go.

8' Sportsmans weight as must a single 10, but a single 10 is less than 2 8' Blades (what the pros run). Each lengths is a 40lb difference

So a single 10' Talon is less than two 8' blades. Is it less than two 8' Pro II's? I dunno' but I bet that's darned close.
But using *that* reasoning, then now it's YOU 'poking at PP' saying we need a 10' over a 8' unit.

(Although I read what you wrote, and I'd never accuse you of something so silly.)


I don't know about "only one dealer uses Talons weight as poor excuse to persuade buyers into PPs."
Nobody persuades me to buy anything! And I've heard the exact same thing from everyone that sells both!

You're even saying that 2 PP's weigh as much as a single Talon.


From PowerPoleTech: The Blades are 37.5 lbs installed. We know that a 12' Talon weighs over 53 lbs installed, it's been in threads discussed ad nauseam here for a while now. The reality is a pair of 12' Talons weigh 143% as much as a pair of 10' Blades, over 32 pounds more. Then if you go to 8' blades they are almost 10 lbs less per pair, Pro II's are about 15 lbs less per pair (than the 10' Blades)

THAT is almost 180% more weight!!!!

There is one other factor, (total transparency here) and that's the braced brackets for the PP product. From what I can find, those brackets add ABOUT 2.5 lbs to each unit installed, for a whopping total of 5 lbs.

When you think of it, 32 pounds is over 5 gallons of fuel. Which would you rather have out on the lake?

When I can put 2 units on the back of a boat, and those units will weigh considerably less than the competition, then that's a factor to consider. Doesn't matter who you are there bud.


FWIW, I really like the idea of the various bottom holding features in the MK product, just not the weight.
Although I prefer the action of PP, and the ability to pull them out of mud better. I would also say the Blade(s) are more aerodynamic, might be taller, but they don't have a big flat box on top. Hold your hand flat out the window doing 60 and see how much wind resistance you feel. Your arm will get the same resistance, but the flat hand on top pushes a LOT harder than the skinny edge.
Talons are also noisier, even Bryan McDonough has stated that. Quote: "And i listened to more then a few from distances I should not be hearing them."

The problem is the line as to what constitutes "shallow water" keeps moving. First we had 8' then 10', 12', and now WOW 15'! I know I'm not the only one that thinks 12' and over is *deep water* nobody needs a 12' or 15' unit in "shallow water". Want to hold the boat still in 'deep' water..... use a trolling motor with the GPS feature.


Simply put... 8' will work in 95% (if not 100%) of what anyone considers "shallow water", period.

Again.... I'm not "poking" at anything. These are the simple facts as we've been seeing them for some time now. I'm a huge fan of MK products, although their lack of a TM that'll work with Lowrance is a huge issue for me in the future. Love my Fortrex, and not really warming up to the idea of a MG to interface with my Lowrance units.

This part was interesting though in some of my research. It was from a BBC Talon OWNER, (that switched to Power Poles).

"however in sandy mucky bottom the sections of the talon would bring all that debris up into the housing causing it to jam up full of crap, and you really had to work them to get them to retract back up....they do have an awful lot of downforce and it's really hard to get them to come back up in soft bottom

you really have to flush them EVERY time you use them
Talons made a lot of noise deploying and retracting...noises like bolts catching up against each other on the way up or down-pinging and clanging and if that small diameter cable jumps off the pulleys inside the talons your done!"

And he did go on to say: "Talons a lot easier to rig on your boat"

My reasoning, (as stated above) for 10' units is they have been quoted as only $200 more for the package. That's a no-brainer!

My reasoning for TWO.... (that was just put VERY CLEARLY to me by my wife) "I'm tired of the boat going in circles in the wind and waves with only one Power Pole, and having to use the trolling motor to DRIVE the boat while you're tying on another lure".


The reality of my first post is reading what I actually wrote......


As you said "Nice Try Though!"

[Randy T]

[LEFT]

Randy, No.... that is NOT what I said. I'm not POKING at MK. I never said "Having a 8' (shallow water anchor from any brand) is not enough".

What I *said* was: "I've been fine so far with a single 8' pole, although this week I'm planning on making the move to dual's, probably Blade 10's."
It's not that I actually NEED a 10' unit, but for ONLY $200 over 8' units..... then why not.
FWIW, None of us NEED a bass boat.

I may have taken that wrong, but you agree that deeper is better and it is better to have more than less?


[COLOR=#222222][FONT=Verdana][COLOR=#222222][FONT=Verdana]

I also agreed that weight isn't really an issue with the pro's
when I said "although with the pro's they really don't care, as long as nobody is fishing in "their spot" when they get there".

The truth however is weight IS AN ISSUE with pretty much everyone else.

Why do they run Evinrude G2's? Seriously??? You know how fast those darned things are, guessing that might play into it juuuuuust a bit.As far as the power plant they are running, again.... money talks. But if I were a pro, and was running a new boat like they do, and could get any sort of discount on a G2, I'd have that puppy IN A MINUTE!
(Try to find a used one for sale on any make bass boat and you have to open the search literally nationwide. Last search I did on Boat Trader there were a total of FOUR in the entire country.)

Not all of them might run lithiums, but you can bet a LOT do! Especially when they can put a sticker on the boat, or a logo on their jerseys! Heck, I've about got my wife talked into them, and by the time my current batteries go belly up (which shouldn't be anytime soon) that may indeed be the direction I go.

I used Engine brand/battery type to null the fact/excuse of the weight gain for Talons over PPs. Obviously they use what they get paid for if available. The reality is that 40lbs is not as big as people make it out to be.

So a single 10' Talon is less than two 8' blades. Is it less than two 8' Pro II's? I dunno' but I bet that's darned close.
But using *that* reasoning, then now it's YOU 'poking at PP' saying we need a 10' over a 8' unit.

(Although I read what you wrote, and I'd never accuse you of something so silly.)

2x 8' Sportsman (lightest model advertised by PP) = 1x 10' Talon which is less than 2x 8' Blades. 2x 8' any PP weighs more than 1x 8' Talon. I used blades because the OP was asking about PROS, and blades what is what they use. Not poking at all to PP, so not sure what you mean there. You compared an 8' model to a 10' model. Then below compared a 10' model to a 12'model. You need to make an even comparison.


I don't know about "only one dealer uses Talons weight as poor excuse to persuade buyers into PPs."
Nobody persuades me to buy anything! And I've heard the exact same thing from everyone that sells both!

You're even saying that 2 PP's weigh as much as a single Talon.


From PowerPoleTech: The Blades are 37.5 lbs installed. We know that a 12' Talon weighs over 53 lbs installed, it's been in threads discussed ad nauseam here for a while now. The reality is a pair of 12' Talons weigh 143% as much as a pair of 10' Blades, over 32 pounds more. Then if you go to 8' blades they are almost 10 lbs less per pair, Pro II's are about 15 lbs less per pair (than the 10' Blades)

THAT is almost 180% more weight!!!!

There is one other factor, (total transparency here) and that's the braced brackets for the PP product. From what I can find, those brackets add ABOUT 2.5 lbs to each unit installed, for a whopping total of 5 lbs.

When you think of it, 32 pounds is over 5 gallons of fuel. Which would you rather have out on the lake?

When I can put 2 units on the back of a boat, and those units will weigh considerably less than the competition, then that's a factor to consider. Doesn't matter who you are there bud.

Again here is an example of where a person claims that 32lbs is so much weight. This is the same thought process is what is used to compare Talons to PP weight differences.

FWIW, I really like the idea of the various bottom holding features in the MK product, just not the weight.
Although I prefer the action of PP, and the ability to pull them out of mud better. I would also say the Blade(s) are more aerodynamic, might be taller, but they don't have a big flat box on top. Hold your hand flat out the window doing 60 and see how much wind resistance you feel. Your arm will get the same resistance, but the flat hand on top pushes a LOT harder than the skinny edge.

Actually I spoke about aerodynamic drag on another thread. Drag is primarily affected by velocity in which the amount of the average bass boat does not generate enough of to make a big enough difference on shallow water anchors. The biggest difference would be seen in the fast 3.Those holes in PPs actually create more drag by creating more turbulent air flow. I did a rough estimate on a 12' Talon face and it is roughly 1.2lbs of drag per 12' Talon @ 70mph

Talons are also noisier, even Bryan McDonough has stated that. Quote: "And i listened to more then a few from distances I should not be hearing them."

The problem is the line as to what constitutes "shallow water" keeps moving. First we had 8' then 10', 12', and now WOW 15'! I know I'm not the only one that thinks 12' and over is *deep water* nobody needs a 12' or 15' unit in "shallow water". Want to hold the boat still in 'deep' water..... use a trolling motor with the GPS feature.


Simply put... 8' will work in 95% (if not 100%) of what anyone considers "shallow water", period.

Nope. Give me 1 or 2 anchors that can hold my bow in whatever direct I choose instead of the wind blowing my tail around. I actually use my 12' in9-11' more than 0-9, and sole decision to buy the Talon over PPs was the 14 spots that I fish in the summer where I need 11' of holding capability.

Again.... I'm not "poking" at anything. These are the simple facts as we've been seeing them for some time now. I'm a huge fan of MK products, although their lack of a TM that'll work with Lowrance is a huge issue for me in the future. Love my Fortrex, and not really warming up to the idea of a MG to interface with my Lowrance units.

These "simple facts" are what PP fans use against Talons, but in reality they are used in such vague or false statements.

This part was interesting though in some of my research. It was from a BBC Talon OWNER, (that switched to Power Poles).

"however in sandy mucky bottom the sections of the talon would bring all that debris up into the housing causing it to jam up full of crap, and you really had to work them to get them to retract back up....they do have an awful lot of downforce and it's really hard to get them to come back up in soft bottom


you really have to flush them EVERY time you use them
Talons made a lot of noise deploying and retracting...noises like bolts catching up against each other on the way up or down-pinging and clanging and if that small diameter cable jumps off the pulleys inside the talons your done!"

And he did go on to say: "Talons a lot easier to rig on your boat"

Never had that problem and neither have many other Talons owners. One persons experience does not justify a product. A lot of those issues come from Talons users not using the soft bottom features. User fault not product fault.

My reasoning, (as stated above) for 10' units is they have been quoted as only $200 more for the package. That's a no-brainer!

My reasoning for TWO.... (that was just put VERY CLEARLY to me by my wife) "I'm tired of the boat going in circles in the wind and waves with only one Power Pole, and having to use the trolling motor to DRIVE the boat while you're tying on another lure".


The reality of my first post is reading what I actually wrote......
And I responded to that in regards to what the OP asked.

Is weight that much of a huge factor or does PowerPole just simply sponsor (provide free PowerPoles) to more pros?

Figured more clarification was needed after those snarky remarks from you about Talons.



As you said "Nice Try Though!"

Try again?

[mastergun]

Captains cash and contingency money

That makes sense. I suppose there is cash payouts for people who win/place with PowerPoles on the boat?

[Bass13]

For the pros not sponsored by Powerpole or Minn Kota it could be a performance issue. Weight is definitely a factor. I run a Skeeter FX 20 with a 250 SHO. Had two 8' Talons on boat when I bought it. Switched to a pair of 10 Blades. Picked up a little over 4 mph.

[DixieChicken]

For the pros not sponsored by Powerpole or Minn Kota it could be a performance issue. Weight is definitely a factor. I run a Skeeter FX 20 with a 250 SHO. Had two 8' Talons on boat when I bought it. Switched to a pair of 10 Blades. Picked up a little over 4 mph.

Weight, aerodynamics, and fluid drag for sure.

But hey.... you'll never convince *some* folks of that.

(

Myself... I'd rather have that extra 5 gallons of gas.

)

[MMyles]

The PP & Talons are both fine pieces of equipment. Each user needs to figure out which unit is best for them and their fishing style. I'm sure the pros get paid to use whatever they have on their boat.

Me personally, I chose Talons over the PP. My reasoning was that I fish big water most of the time so speed has never really been a factor....in fact, speed has NEVER been a factor in any tournament I have personally been involved with over the past 30 years. You're either on fish from pre-fishing or you need to find fish during the tournament. Reading water quickly has always been more important in the success I have had over the years.

Other deciding factors were that my boat would have a 4-stroke with no oil reservoir to slop oil in my bilge compartment, so I did not want to take the chance of HF leaking and slopping around in my bilge. The extra length of the Talon's were extremely important to me due to the lakes and conditions I fish. October in Michigan would be a good example of needing the extra length to hold in heavy wind on a large school of smallies without spooking them with a trolling motor.

So for me personally, the Talon's were a better decision.

M

[DixieChicken]

Try again?

Not that it matters to ultimate fan......, but speaking of the "Pros", and comparing Blades to Talons, you MUST compare 8' poles to 12' talons.
YOU SAID the pros run 8' Blades, remember!

I put the numbers out there for ALL the sizes so anyone could see them. However, when you talk about 12' Talons to 8' blades now you're talking about a single Talon weighing as much as a pair of 8' poles, with just over twice as much weight at the back of the boat.

(

I was trying to give the Talons an edge there by going with the heaviest PP's

.)

Troubles with both exist, I just happened to run across a larger number of them that complained about one product getting stuck in the mud.
FWIW mine (single pole) got stuck in the down position last time out, faulty controller module. Took about 2 minutes with a wrench to pull a hose and I pulled it up. Mama says get new ones, so we're getting new ones. (plural)

Where *I* fish, and for *my* boat, weight makes a BIG difference. Often we'll go to the lake with the better part of a full tank of gas. The ol' Z9 holds SIXTY SIX gallons! Not many bass boats even come close. Weight, fluid and aerodynamic drag are very real, and they ARE an issue. It's not ALL about speed, but a lighter boat moves through the water better and gets better MPG.

Not having a horse in the race I could care less which ones they are, or what label is on them. Just what works, is cheaper, and weighs less.

Obviously you don't feel the same.

Can't imagine what you'd have to say about someone going with all lithium's.

(

For the weight savings

.)

You're right, I'm wrong, how DARE me consider the FACTS!

Seacrest OUT

[Randy T]

Not that it matters to ultimate fan......, but speaking of the "Pros", and comparing Blades to Talons, you MUST compare 8' poles to 12' talons.
YOU SAID the pros run 8' Blades, remember!

I put the numbers out there for ALL the sizes so anyone could see them. However, when you talk about 12' Talons to 8' blades now you're talking about a single Talon weighing as much as a pair of 8' poles, with just over twice as much weight at the back of the boat.

(

I was trying to give the Talons an edge there by going with the heaviest PP's

.)

Troubles with both exist, I just happened to run across a larger number of them that complained about one product getting stuck in the mud.
FWIW mine (single pole) got stuck in the down position last time out, faulty controller module. Took about 2 minutes with a wrench to pull a hose and I pulled it up. Mama says get new ones, so we're getting new ones. (plural)

Where *I* fish, and for *my* boat, weight makes a BIG difference. Often we'll go to the lake with the better part of a full tank of gas. The ol' Z9 holds SIXTY SIX gallons! Not many bass boats even come close. Weight, fluid and aerodynamic drag are very real, and they ARE an issue. It's not ALL about speed, but a lighter boat moves through the water better and gets better MPG.

Not having a horse in the race I could care less which ones they are, or what label is on them. Just what works, is cheaper, and weighs less.

Obviously you don't feel the same.

Can't imagine what you'd have to say about someone going with all lithium's.

(

For the weight savings

.)

You're right, I'm wrong, how DARE me consider the FACTS!

Seacrest OUT

No a 8' PP to a 10' or 12' Talon does not compare. 8s to 8s and 10s to 10s etc.... compare You are the one comparing a shorter PP to a longer Talon. The specs you gave are not false, but the comparison is not fair either. If and when PP make a 12' model then those weights can be compared, but as of now, if a person wants to use a shallow water anchor in more than 10', really 9.5' of water, they have to deal with the weight of the 12' or 15' Talon.

Actually back on track for drag. You talked about the profile from the Talons causing drag. Nothing to do with drag on the hull from water. Yes weight is an issue, but once again the weight gain on the Talons is not as large as it is made out to be. Yes Velocity IS the biggest factor on drag, it is the factor that is squared in the drag equation. You would do fine with 40gal of gas and save yourself 156lbs right there, nearly 4x the weight different between equal length PPs and Talons. If you want to use your 66gal fuel tank to justify 2x 10' PPs and not have Talons because of the addition weight, well you could still run 57gal of gas and still be of equal weight of 2x 12' Talons.

Let them go lithiums. They reduce battery weight roughly 130-150lbs in a 36v system. If that was the case between shallow water anchors of equal holding depth then I would say the same.

[eliteangler]

No a 8' PP to a 10' or 12' Talon does not compare. 8s to 8s and 10s to 10s etc.... compare You are the one comparing a shorter PP to a longer Talon. The specs you gave are not false, but the comparison is not fair either. If and when PP make a 12' model then those weights can be compared, but as of now, if a person wants to use a shallow water anchor in more than 10', really 9.5' of water, they have to deal with the weight of the 12' or 15' Talon.

Actually back on track for drag. You talked about the profile from the Talons causing drag. Nothing to do with drag on the hull from water. Yes weight is an issue, but once again the weight gain on the Talons is not as large as it is made out to be. Yes Velocity IS the biggest factor on drag, it is the factor that is squared in the drag equation. You would do fine with 40gal of gas and save yourself 156lbs right there, nearly 4x the weight different between equal length PPs and Talons. If you want to use your 66gal fuel tank to justify 2x 10' PPs and not have Talons because of the addition weight, well you could still run 57gal of gas and still be of equal weight of 2x 12' Talons.

Let them go lithiums. They reduce battery weight roughly 130-150lbs in a 36v system. If that was the case between shallow water anchors of equal holding depth then I would say the same.

Not choosing sides or anything, but I own two 10' Blades and I can hold at 9.5 ft just fine. In fact, that 9.5 ft is what is being read from the transducer that is actually a foot below the surface when anchored down because it's mounted to the bottom of my jack-plate. So... actually, 10.5 ft. Like I said, not trying to choose sides. I agree with one of the fellas that posted above when he said that they are both good products but each have their advantages/disadvantages. The angler has to decide what will work best for the water he/she is fishing the most.