Helix 7 DI G2N and Helix 12 Mega SI G2N - Issues

[Whistler]

Both units are running the latest version of code 1.610.

I've got the two systems communicating and working via Ethernet network. The Helix 7 is just intended for mapping and occasional DI no transducer is directly connected. It is getting sonar info from the Helix 12 via Ethernet. For the most part, things are working OK but I have noticed a couple of issues and was wondering if others are seeing this and also wondering if Humminbird is working on a fix for this.

Issue #1
2d Sonar looks like garbage on both the 7 and natively on the 12. The sonar is very blocky/grainy or pixelated. I noticed this on a previous version of the software and was able to eliminate it by disabling chirp or setting the 2D sonar frequency to High. I don't remember which of those worked, but I've tried both along with many variation on the updated version but I can't eliminate it any longer.



Issue #2
Disabling views on the Helix 7 unit (the slave unit) doesn't really disable the view. Its seems that any 2d, SI, or DI view that the master unit (Helix 12) has visible, shows on the Helix 7 slave unit regardless of whether or not the view is marked as hidden on the Helix 7 unit.

Anyone else seeing these two problems?

[sfw1960]

Do you have SONAR off on the Helix 7 before it's been damaged?

[Whistler]

Do you have SONAR off on the Helix 7 before it's been damaged?

I don't quite understand what you are asking. There is no transducer connected to the Helix 7. It is getting sonar data from the network. I have not turned off sonar on the Helix 7. Are you saying I should?

[Wayne P.]

I don't quite understand what you are asking. There is no transducer connected to the Helix 7. It is getting sonar data from the network. I have not turned off sonar on the Helix 7. Are you saying I should?

YES

[tweakjr]

On the unit that has no transducer connected, be sure sonar is turned OFF, otherwise you'll risk damage to the unit eventually.
Electrically speaking, if sonar is turned on, it needs to see a load on the transducer circuit.
Press the power button once(after the unit has already been turned on) and select sonar OFF for the unit which the transducer is not hooked up and only used for mapping.

[Whistler]

Will it remember that setting or am I going to have to do that each time? If there is no load on that circuit, why is that a problem? No load means no current flow. It's an open circuit. Unless those pins act as a transmitting antenna at that point. Which could cause RF noise.

Can you guys point me to the HB docs that recommend that? I'm just curious as to what they say.

[sfw1960]

YES

Thanks for "confirming that" Wayne...



HB doesn't have a specific area they call that out online I can recall - in the manual ~ probably in the Ethernet networking section - though it could be under Sonar.

The facts are an unloaded transmitter circuit is sending power into "nothing" and the hi-wattage pulses into "nothing" turn to heat.

Heat and semiconductors don't get along, semiconductors contain smoke - and when you let the smoke out; they cease to function properly.

YES - it retains the setting, it's RIGHT THERE under the power menu, so you have no reason NOT to look at what your machine is telling you.

Disconnect the 7 from the 12 & see what the 12 does alone, hopefully things are still functioning, and YES - if you have to do a reset on 'em & start again.... you may have to.

You all set on proof of what the right thing to do is yet?
"The Docs" are read directly from your owners manual actually, I just don't recall which page - and almost certainly differs between the differing Gen unit's series.

[Whistler]

I reached out to Humminbird support today to see if there was any issue in running the slave unit (Helix 7) that is networked to my Helix 12 without having a transducer connected to the Helix 7 and they assured me that there is not. They said that as long as the slave unit is configured to read sonar from the network then there is no issue.

Now that that is out of the way. Back to the original question of the post. Has anyone else experienced what I described in the question I originally posted?

I even noticed the blocky, pixelated, sonar returns I described in screen shots from some of the Humminbird documentation so others must be seeing something similar. I linked an image from the HB docs showing the blocky/grainy sonar that I see.

[sfw1960]

It's no secret that HB CSRs have been incorrect on occasion and one rep can be far more knowledgeable than others.

Configuring for Ethernet includes turning SONAR OFF - and if you don't want to listen to folks that have plenty of experience on the equipment you are asking about, maybe you should have asked the CSR what the problem is since you called them.

When you come on a site to as for help and advice, then you might want to take it rather than spend time contradicting or questioning it.

There's a core group of guys here that know the product well, and I have personally been running multiple networked HB units since early 2014 and I know my way around a HB network and have run a 999ci HDSI an entire season with only a power cord and Ethernet cable with great results.

Just between Wayne and myself, collectively we have a shade over 50 years combined experience using Sonar/GPS and we help dozens of people every week if they want it.

Slowing the scroll rate will help with the blocky pixels, as will lowering the Chirp sweep range.

You may want to switch over to 200/83 kHz dual beam setting to give better arches also.

Again, not knowing the settings used, a reset STILL may be in order.

[Whistler]

Now, won't disabling sonar at the power button disable all down and sonar views as well?. That seems to be the case on my unit and if that is the case, that isn't a workable solution. As i stated in my original post, though mapping is my primary use case, i will also be using it for some DI and sonar as well.

[Wayne P.]

Hey Robert. Maybe if you weren't such an arrogant jerk in your responses, people like myself wouldn't question your "expertise". Your last response is a great example of that. And if running multiple units since 2014 makes you an expert then i must be a step or two above that level as I've had multiple units for much longer. Try not to be so sensitive if someone doesn't blindly take your word for it. Some of us like to really understand theses units, not just have some tool tell us they are an internet expert.

I do appreciate others knowledge, but man... Your delivery could seriously use some work. I spent years over on the other HB forum and never had anyone speak to me like you have.

Now, won't disabling sonar at the power button disable all down and sonar views as well?. That seems to be the case on my unit and if that is the case, that isn't a workable solution. As i stated in my original post, though mapping is my primary use case, i will also be using it for some DI and sonar as well.

No, turning Sonar OFF does not affect getting sonar from another source via Ethernet. It just turns off the broadcasting of sonar pulses with the unit you turn off.
All you have to do is try it and see for yourself.

[bobcoy]

Whistler, talk about a snarky comment! "Now that that is out of the way. Back to the original question of the post. Has anyone else experienced what I described in the question I originally posted?"

[CSF]

Both units are running the latest version of code 1.610.

I've got the two systems communicating and working via Ethernet network. The Helix 7 is just intended for mapping and occasional DI no transducer is directly connected. It is getting sonar info from the Helix 12 via Ethernet. For the most part, things are working OK but I have noticed a couple of issues and was wondering if others are seeing this and also wondering if Humminbird is working on a fix for this.

Issue #1
2d Sonar looks like garbage on both the 7 and natively on the 12. The sonar is very blocky/grainy or pixelated. I noticed this on a previous version of the software and was able to eliminate it by disabling chirp or setting the 2D sonar frequency to High. I don't remember which of those worked, but I've tried both along with many variation on the updated version but I can't eliminate it any longer.



Issue #2
Disabling views on the Helix 7 unit (the slave unit) doesn't really disable the view. Its seems that any 2d, SI, or DI view that the master unit (Helix 12) has visible, shows on the Helix 7 slave unit regardless of whether or not the view is marked as hidden on the Helix 7 unit.

Anyone else seeing these two problems?

When all sonar data source is the master unit the slave unit no longer pings its transducer, I just double checked mine to verify. You are safe running no transducer as long as either turn sonar off or make sure all sonar data source is the master unit. I agree with turning off sonar to be double safe.

[Whistler]

CSF - It seems to me that if I disable sonar on the slave unit (the Helix 7) then from the slave unit I don't have access to any of the shared sonar views from the main unit. Though my primary use for the slave will be mapping, I will also use it for DI occasionally which doesn't seem possible with sonar disabled on the slave unit. Can you confirm that you see this behavior as well?

[Whistler]

Whistler, talk about a snarky comment! "Now that that is out of the way. Back to the original question of the post. Has anyone else experienced what I described in the question I originally posted?"

My intention here isn't to argue with anyone. But the thread had diverged from my original purpose which was to discuss the two problems I outlined. The "disable sonar" suggestion seems to be irrelevant when the slave unit is connected to another unit and getting all of its sonar info from that other unit. Thus my comment. It wasn't intended to be "snarky", it was intended to get us back to the questions at hand, but I can see where it could be taken that way. So my apologies.

[sfw1960]

@ Chris - if sonar is disabled on a newer update, it is an undocumented change and I will continue to have folks turn off sonar, as the older units did NOT and a friend fried one using it as GPS on Saginaw Bay running out on a sled.

As far as my posts - helping folks I guess I'm to blame for people's perception, I can't always spoon feed folks like they want - or sugar coat things.

I have noticed another very experienced user here generally goes silent on a subject, he often does that when people don't heed advice.

I should do that more often myself too.

I have plenty thick skin as a MOD on another site, so I'm not leaving with hurt feelings - I'm not even going to wish anyone luck with their problems.

Since I am being called a jerk - might as well do the time.


Don't worry about me Bobcoy - it's just part of the things we do, and every once in a while a "Rob0225" comes along.


Have fun with it guys!
RAS

[bobcoy]

Not worried about you,you are a big boy. Just adjusting the Jerk arrow in the proper direction. Bob

[sfw1960]

It's all good in the hood Bob, and I will always try to help people out when I can~ I hope everyone KNOWS that.



Let's move forward & see if we can get this figured out...

[Hollada]

Was there ever a resolution to the pixelation question?

Lots of bunched panties, but didn’t see an answer?

[BrownTrout]

Be helpful if the op posted a pic of the "pixelated" garbage he is seeing on his unit rather than a pic from the user manual. That pic appears to be set in Max mode as compared to Clear mode. Might this explain what Whistler is commenting on?

Not trying to crash the party, but when I'm actually fishing I prefer 2D sonar on the screen. I point my console Helix 10 SI Mega Chirp G2N to the bow Helix 10 DI Mega Chirp G2N so my partner can see what I see off the HW xdcr on the bow. Both units have their own transducers. Should I be turning Sonar Off on the console unit when doing this?