Crazy. If I did not read it on the MK website I would not have believed it was there.
My last 3 boats and my new one have run a Minn Kota 36 volt powered by lithium’s with out any issues!!
I'm not concerned about running my Battle Born's with my Minn Kota ultrex. The job I had before my current one I worked in a electric motor plant.. We made small a.c. and d.c. motors. I do not see 1 more volt per battery causing premature failure in a motor.
Last edited by Buck456; 01-16-2018 at 09:34 PM.
"Minn Kota does not recommend the use Lithium Ion batteries. Lithium Ion batteries run at a higher voltage for longer periods versus traditional lead-acid batteries. This can lead to overheating of the motor circuitry and cause premature failures. Due to this Minn Kota does not support the use of Lithium Ion batteries for powering our trolling motors"
One of the dumbest things I've read for awhile. And it says nothing about AGM's that perform better than the lead-acid batteries. If I wouldn't have seen it on the MK website I would have bet it came from the lounge........
Never heard that sales pitch before. Buy 2 so when one fails you can have a backup!
Thankfully I bought 2 36 volt lithium pro batteries so when I sent mine in I still had a backup, but not sure I would consider it a sales tactic. Love the weight savings and my new one they sent back has been great though.
2007 Sterling 22xs-Yamaha 250-Dual 10 foot blades-Ipilot-Bobs Jack plate-HDS 8 (SOLD)
2016 Sterling 220XS: (SOLD)
2008 SCB Topcat 250 XS (SOLD)
Current:
2014 SCB Stingray Sport Merc 300XS
2018 ES Custom Revolution 25 Merc 400R
2021 Caymas CX21/Mercury 250 Pro XS
Any chance this is a distinction between lithium "ion" and lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) batteries?
All "lithiums" are not the same. It's subtle, but likely a difference worth nothing. I think lithium-ions end up with 3.6-3.7 volts per cell. That's 14.4 volts with 4 cells in a "12 volt" battery assuming the lower 3.6 volts per cell which jives with the higher voltage claim and would scare me a bit. If it's 3.7 volts per cell, that's even more extreme at 14.8 volts from 4 cells. Contrast this with the lithium iron phosphates are 3.2-3.3 volts per cell. Assuming 3.3 volts per cell, that's 13.2 volts in a "12 volt" battery which is very close to what you'd see with traditional technology.
I believe most (if not all) of the lithium batteries being sold as trolling motor batteries are LiFePO4 which means they're not putting out extra voltage, and are also not the "lithium ions" that Minn Kota says are bad. LiFePO4 also offers a much, much lower risk of fires and all the rest you hear about from lithium batteries.
Regardless, assuming the batteries are LiFePO4, there's your way around a denied warranty claim. "They're not lithium ions."
2011 Skeeter ZX225
225 Yamaha HPDI Series 2
Minn Kota Ultrex 112 52"
Console: HDS 16 Carbon
Bow: HDS 12 Carbon, Solix 12 G2, Mega 360
2021 Caymas CX21/Mercury 250 Pro XS
A lot of people and even companies that sell the batteries call LiFePO4s "lithium ion," but I think that's laziness. In researching building a battery pack for my uses from scratch, I've learned that the companies that manufacture the cells are very, very careful to distinguish between lithium ion, lithium polymer, and lithium iron phosphate. I think you could argue that they're all lithium ion from a battery chemistry perspective, but that's not what the industry itself uses. Were it to get to that point, distinctions involving "trade" names are used all the time in lawsuits about things like this.
To your point, given that the nominal voltage of a LiFePO4 is lower than the nominal voltage on a charge lead acid or AGM battery, that would make what Minn Kota wrote not just overly cautious, but patently false.
2011 Skeeter ZX225
225 Yamaha HPDI Series 2
Minn Kota Ultrex 112 52"
Console: HDS 16 Carbon
Bow: HDS 12 Carbon, Solix 12 G2, Mega 360
Good point. Battle Born batteries are a LifePo4 battery. I would also say you are onto something when it comes to warranty claim. Just to put some people at ease I've had a warranty claim on my Ultrex I had no questions asked about what type of battery I use. I even raved to the shop how much I like my Battle Borns. They took care of my problem the way Minn kota normally does.
Last edited by Buck456; 01-17-2018 at 05:09 PM.
This doesn't particularly matter, it's a square is a rectangle argument. All Lithium Ion batteries are some sort of metal salt. I imagine companies will specifiy their battery is LiFePO4 to justify the higher cost compared to some other lithium salt chemistry or to say theirs is best for the application. Other manufacturers would also lean away from over specifying their chemistry if they thought it would lose them market share.
The info below is from Wikipedia, sorry for the bolded section, I couldn't get it to not do that.
"A lithium-ion battery or Li-ion battery (abbreviated as LIB) is a type of rechargeable battery in which lithium ions move from the negative electrode to the positive electrode during discharge and back when charging. Li-ion batteries use an intercalated lithium compound as one electrode material, compared to the metalliclithium used in a non-rechargeable lithium battery. The electrolyte, which allows for ionic movement, and the two electrodes are the constituent components of a lithium-ion battery cell.
Chemistry, performance, cost and safety characteristics vary across LIB types. Handheld electronics mostly use LIBs based on lithium cobalt oxide (LiCoO2), which offers high energy density, but presents safety risks, especially when damaged. Lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4), lithium ion manganese oxide battery (LiMn2O4, Li2MnO3, or LMO) and lithium nickel manganese cobalt oxide (LiNiMnCoO2 or NMC) offer lower energy density, but longer lives and less likelihood of unfortunate events in real world use, (e.g., fire, explosion, ...). Such batteries are widely used for electric tools, medical equipment, and other roles. NMC in particular is a leading contender for automotive applications. Lithium nickel cobalt aluminum oxide (LiNiCoAlO2 or NCA) and lithium titanate (Li4Ti5O12 or LTO) are specialty designs aimed at particular niche roles. The newer lithium–sulfur batteries promise the highest performance-to-weight ratio."
Last edited by Dh0ckey11; 01-18-2018 at 07:28 AM. Reason: line breaks were weird
2021 Caymas CX21/Mercury 250 Pro XS
I don't think I worded my response well. I'm with you that all lithiums batteries are lithium ion batteries from a battery chemistry perspective. Just pointing out the different trade names used for different chemistries, why they're particularly important for voltage sensitive applications, and how that could relate to the warnings Minn Kota is putting into their literature.
2011 Skeeter ZX225
225 Yamaha HPDI Series 2
Minn Kota Ultrex 112 52"
Console: HDS 16 Carbon
Bow: HDS 12 Carbon, Solix 12 G2, Mega 360
Mike
2019 Ranger 520L w/ 250HO ETEC G2
2011 Tracker 175TXW w/ 75HO ETEC