Gary, Leonard & others

[DonnieG]

that have had both the PS-31 & PS-21.

Does the PS-31 have the same type of interference that the PS-21 is having?

Was out yesterday with a partner that had never seen Panoptix. My PS-30 was as clear, very clear, but we eventually turned the PS-21 off because of clutter filled screen..Occasionally we could see our jigs when pitched out less than 20' with the PS-21 but would quickly lose them in the screen clutter.

Very disgusting. I'm not the only one having this problem.

[Larry3215]

Are you talking about the "rays" or the radar pings or just random dots/speckles/noise? I cant remember - did you post any screen shots?

[fishfood]

I would like to know also. We couldn't see 1/4 oz jigs more than 15ft or so and it was a "flash" more than a solid signal.

I'm new so I take that into account but I'd rather spend my time testing with what you guys think is the best. The steerable beam is catching my attention also.

The guy I'm testing for wants no fuss. This may be a case of "you get what you pay for"?

[Todd Driscoll]

that have had both the PS-31 & PS-21.

Does the PS-31 have the same type of interference that the PS-21 is having?

Was out yesterday with a partner that had never seen Panoptix. My PS-30 was as clear, very clear, but we eventually turned the PS-21 off because of clutter filled screen..Occasionally we could see our jigs when pitched out less than 20' with the PS-21 but would quickly lose them in the screen clutter.

Very disgusting. I'm not the only one having this problem.

Donnie, can you please provide some screenshots of the PS 21 interference you are having issues with? Or better yet, an iPhone video using Garmin Helm?

[DonnieG]

Donnie, can you please provide some screenshots of the PS 21 interference you are having issues with? Or better yet, an iPhone video using Garmin Helm?

Todd, I will set it up with my iPhone on the next trip. I have videos from my iPhone but they are PS-30, no PS-21.

[LWINCHESTER2]

I agree with Todd. Screenshots or a video would help a lot. The background of the PS21 and PS31 is nothing like the backgound of 2d sonar. And there does seem to be more "noise" on the PS21 than on the PS31, but that's likely due to the cone being less than half the cone of the PS21. I usually run the PS31 on 20 degres. It's wide enough so that I can pan around and not have to worry about doing it at just the right speed. At first all the little speckles distracted me. Now, they don't. I focused on looking for what I call doughnuts with a red center. It's a mental thing. I'm looking for red and so a lot of this other stuff may be there but I've gotten used to it and pay it no mind whatsoever. It did bug me to start with though. Attached is a rather ordinary shot.

Looking forward to your video.

[skid00skid00]

How much sonar reflection can you get off of a 1/4 oz lead jig head? It's not like an air bladder...

[Treeguyus]

Hear about interference with the PS-21, not my experience with the 31as the screen shots show. The upper left hand corner is some interference from wash of troll motor. My 31 is mounted on the bottom of the terrova motor housing. Bow mount lift works wonderfully raising and lowering as needed.

No complaints here

The pictures are taken with a camera not screen shots....

Qualify my opinion, a little interference is ok as I have my gain/power up. Not a concern of mine with a little interference on the screen

[Larry3215]

Thats about right for a small jig like that. If its flashing maybe its moving too fast. Im not 100% sure on this but it seems like fast targets dont show up as well as slower targets do.

Ive tracked seals and diving birds that show up great one second then disappear but then show up again a good distance from where they started. Im thinking they show up better moving slow and disappear when they sprint after food.

I would like to know also. We couldn't see 1/4 oz jigs more than 15ft or so and it was a "flash" more than a solid signal.

I'm new so I take that into account but I'd rather spend my time testing with what you guys think is the best. The steerable beam is catching my attention also.

The guy I'm testing for wants no fuss. This may be a case of "you get what you pay for"?

[JordanC]

Donnie, can you please provide some screenshots of the PS 21 interference you are having issues with? Or better yet, an iPhone video using Garmin Helm?

[IMG][/IMG]

[JordanC]

Sorry to jump on someone's thread but I am experiencing the same issue. It only seems to get worse with the updates. Bought it last April and it was never this bad when I first installed it.

[fishfood]

Shot video today of both types of interference. Hopefully will have them up on youtube tomorrow but may be Monday since work is 50 times faster upload :-)

[Larry3215]

Jordan, Id suggest you turn off the Trails feature. It will get rid of a lot of the purple and give you less clutter on screen. You might also try upping the Noise Reduction settings and see how that does.

Do you have those rays all the time or only when the trolling motor is running?

You said its worse now - have you changed anything to do with the trolling motor or chargers or wiring or??

Sorry to jump on someone's thread but I am experiencing the same issue. It only seems to get worse with the updates. Bought it last April and it was never this bad when I first installed it.

[Treeguyus]

The only interference I have experienced on my PS-31 occurred when I had the transducer angle to tight against or close to troll motor housing which drove the signal at a more direct angle into the bottom. Found a 40-45 degree back was perfect.

But in my amateur opinion the lobe on the left side of the screen looks to be pointed such causing to drive signals direct into the bottom, is the interference bounce back?

There is a sweet spot on angle off the troll motor shaft (90 degrees) 40-45 degrees.

Throwing this out, not sure if the cause but worth looking at.

Also the PS-31 wire is isolated is routed away from all wires. The same on my 2D or DS. Also the transducer is networked via a Garmin GMS 10

Seems the interference is a issue with the 21 am I correct

[Larry3215]

Here are the quotes from Todd about the "rays" that I have seen so far.

http://www.bbcboards.net/showthread.php?t=770882

He doesnt mention the PS31 specifically, but I would have assumed it would behave more like the PS30, but maybe not. I cant remember anyone saying they saw the rays on a PS31 so far. Maybe he will chime in.

Donnie, sorry it took a while to respond to this thread. I was waiting for the lead Panoptix engineer to get back in after the holidays. He indicates that the trolling motor interference you are experiencing (2 or 3 weak lines) is normal, and results from the methods used to reduce bottom clutter. I have had the exact same interference with my PS21, and as you indicate, this minor interference does not affect how I use it at all (doesn't mask any fish or structure).

Relative to PS30, it also has the same type of trolling motor interference, but it presents itself in just a single line, mostly off the edge of the view.

Also note that when you run a PS21 and 30 at the same time, this can also cause sonar interference (in addition to potential interference from trolling motor) that behaves as I stated earlier where the 21 shows it as potentially 3 lines and the PS30 shows it as one line to the side. This isn’t a defective situation or anything, just acoustic interference.

In JordanC's case, I wouldnt call those "weak lines", but that could be due to his settings - Trials on, Hi Gain, low noise reduction - and/or possibly an especially bad trolling motor that puts out more interference.

This is a case where it varies a lot from one setup to another, which makes it difficult to pin down.

[JordanC]

Jordan, Id suggest you turn off the Trails feature. It will get rid of a lot of the purple and give you less clutter on screen. You might also try upping the Noise Reduction settings and see how that does.

Do you have those rays all the time or only when the trolling motor is running?

You said its worse now - have you changed anything to do with the trolling motor or chargers or wiring or??

The rays only happen when I activate my trolling motor. Same thing happens on the Garmin video that Bill Dance did for them. When I first got the ps-21 April 2016 it was on the 1st version of software and that is when the image and ability to see my lure clearly was the best. That was with everything set to factory settings. After a few software updates I found myself needing to adjust where it was mounted on the shaft and play with the settings to get it clear again. I have a brand new fortrex so that shouldn't be an issue. I have the sensitivity set between 78-80 with noise rejection between low and medium, manual distance set at 60 feet , auto depth, and I think the trails are set to medium. I have the gt-52 transducer cable isolated from the ps-21 cable under the shroud but obviously they are tied together on the shaft. I have bought new wiring to install once it gets warm that will bypass the stock wiring harness and go straight to my odyssey battery. I have 2 echomap chirp 93sv's, one on the console and the other connected to the ps-21. They are networked to share waypoints. Boat is a 2007 Triton Tr-186.

[Larry3215]

From what Todd has said, I dont think this is like the typical trolling motor interference you see on traditional sonar. That kind of interference is almost always electrical in nature and is conducted through wiring, common grounds, or cables too close to each other, etc. You fix it by fixing the wiring issues - hopefully.

Todd said this is acoustical interference. That would mean that the trolling motor is putting out sonar/sounds into the water at close to the same frequency range that the Panoptix operate at - 415khz. This acoustical interference would be traveling through the water and not through the wires. Its similar to what you see when you have two regular transducers operating on the same frequency. The only difference is its the trolling motor and not another transducer creating the noise.

Im afraid fixing this is going to be more difficult than adding a ground wire or ferrite choke to your trolling motor wires.

Someone posted recently that they were getting some interference from another sideview transducer operating on 455 khz. That was the "radar pings" and not the rays though. The solution there would be to change to 800khz or 265 khz.

I dont know of any way to change the frequency your trolling motor is putting out. Im pretty sure the source would have to be the speed controller. All modern speed controller on trolling motors vary the speed by switching the power on and off very rapidly. The frequency of the on/off switching varies as you change the speed. Slower at low speeds and faster at hi speeds. But there is no switching at full speed.

Im thinking that some trolling motors must be hitting near that 415 khz at some middle speeds and causing the problem. I know its not all trolling motors because I dont have that issue at all with my 2 year old Powerdrive V2. So far, the problem seems to be limited to only a few users, but I have no clue if its newer TM's or brand specific or model specific or what. We need to gather more data to see if there is a pattern or not.

[Larry3215]

One more thing - Todd also said this was in some way related to the way the software in the PS21 handles bottom clutter. That gives me hope the engineers can fix it with a software change - maybe. Hopefully Todd will jump back in and clarify that.

Id recommend calling customer support and pestering them about it. Squeaky wheels and all that :)