27p Bravo 1 XS on a Phoenix 920/Verado 250 pro

[RISE]

As title states, can I do it and get the RPM's I need out of the motor and will I even be able to wind it up enough to get it out of the hole? Currently running a 25p Fury and wondering if this is just too much prop for this set-up?

[RISE]

Anybody? What are you guys running on your 250 V-rod pros? Should I just get the 26p bravo? If so, which one? FS or XS?

[RISE]

...........crickets chirping.......

[npark]

Need some stats on current setup, what speed and RPM is the Fury pulling? What's the rest of the setup, load, power poles, JP etc etc? What don't you like in the Fury you are trying to accomplish with the Bravo?

[golfpro307]

Need some stats on current setup, what speed and RPM is the Fury pulling? What's the rest of the setup, load, power poles, JP etc etc? What don't you like in the Fury you are trying to accomplish with the Bravo?

I 2nd that. Your running a 3 blade now and want to jump up to a 27 Bravo.. I would say a 26p Bravo would probably offer better holeshot but nt sure about the top end. Like Npark said need your numbers to help ya out. Nice setup.

Chris

[RISE]

Need some stats on current setup, what speed and RPM is the Fury pulling? What's the rest of the setup, load, power poles, JP etc etc? What don't you like in the Fury you are trying to accomplish with the Bravo?

Thanks for the response guys and thank you for the compliment Chris, appreciate that.
I wasn't sure if the 27 would be too much prop...though it might work well on the top end but figured getting it out of the hole would require another set of vents.
Ok, Heavy load, usually at least a half to 2/3 tank of gas, Atlas 6" hydraulic plate, dual 12 ft. talons, lithium batteries (4 weighing 28 lbs. each so I've shaved off about 150-160 lbs from group 31 optimas) I hit 75.2/6100-ish RPM's for a second, first time out, about 4 hours into break-in. She was a HANDFUL...lots of chine but I'm hoping a 4-blade and some seat time will help. I have not been able to repeat this since then (gotten real close though). Hole shot is horrible below 16 on JP gauge. If I'm up high (16-18) on JP, hole shot is pretty darn good and then I have to lower the motor a bit as I get on pad (12-14 depending on how much I'm wanting to trim her up). My motor is mounted in second hole from the top, which I thought was not right as I'm always needing to keep it up high when stopped to be above the static water line (back of boat sits low in the water). Anyways, this rig/motor is totally new to me and I'm not a "great" driver yet, so a more stable ride would be nice and of course I would like to keep my top speed at least where its at. I'm wanting better hole shot, better load carrying capabilities and to tame the chine. I've never owned a 4 blade so I have no idea which one to get and what to honestly expect.

Greg

[npark]

Ok that get the wheels turning, couple more questions. Does the Fury have any vents or PVS holes in it and are they open or closed? What's you WP during holeshot and at WOT, also what's your prop height measurement at the 12-14 setting? When the holeshot is terrible does it just bog and lug or bog then blow out and when it's good is the prop biting, on the edge of blowing out or blowing out? What are the RPMs it pulls during those times?

Even before these answer I would say that I would bring the engine up that last hole as you are using more of the upper end range of the JP never touching anything lower than 12-14. It sounds like more height during holeshot would just help more...depends on WP though.

Not so sure that a 4 blade is going to help the chine walk issue if that's a primary concern. In my experience they make it worse but we also run super high on the pad. I'd suggest if chine is an issue you are wanting to eliminate that you spend a little time ballasting the boat. Does it do it more or less with a passenger or by yourself? Some more time fighting it to learn how to control it might be in order too as this sounds like a new combo for you.

[cbailey]

first off, congrats on the new rig!

there is several things you can do to improve holeshot. if you can run a jig saw, get 2 pieces of aluminum. cut one to fit bottom of jackplate(box it in) put a bouncy ball in jackplate and put the other piece on top of jackplate. this will help hole shot, it will allow you to run shallower water without bottom of boat dragging and will help when fishing a wind blown point. the nose will not blow around as much with the stern lifted higher in the water column. this will also help with washing the back beck off when you set boat down after a run. the plates on jackplate is very simple to do. cut them out, drill and tap for 1/4" holes on the top and bottom of jackplate in all four corners(8 holes total) and bolt them down. when cutn plates, allow for jackplate movement. you dont want plates built and bolted on and not be able to adjust jackplate if necessary. pvs holes in prop is a good start too. the more the motor bogs on take off, the more ventilation you need. remove a pvs plug untill it comes out like you like. if it still doesnt, a foil is a very good investment. they will cut your holeshot in half most of the time. easy bolt on! there are alot of them made but get the Bmans foil. they are cool looking and functional. i would also start coming up on jackplate till you start losing water psi or the boat starts to slow down. the chime walk is easy to fix. im guessing because you are running lith batts, you are out of balance a good bit. set in boat while in lake, put a 4' level across back deck(side to side) this will show you how you are out of balance. move your tackle/gear around till boat is level. in some cases, you may have to move batterys or even add shot bags to balance boat. dont worry though about adding weight, a balanced boat thats heavier will be faster than the same boat lighter and out of balance!! this will be your starting point. the torque of motor @ wot will pick the port side of boat so you will need to add a touch more weight to port side. it doesnt have to be perfect to drive it wide open, just close. if you are running split tanks, you can adjust ballast with fuel but keep in mind that the more fuel you burn, the more it will affect balance. if it has a fuel tank in the middle, then it doesnt matter.

before i bought a prop, i would get the boat setup as best as you can with the wheel you have. a good prop guy can adjust for holeshot, midrange and top end on the wheel you have at a later date. balancing the boat WILL make the boat faster. the less driver input it requires, the faster it will be!!

1. balance boat
2. pull pvs holes till motor doesnt bog
3 foil, a must for any rig
4 enclose jackplate and add ball for floatation
5 send prop to a qualified prop guy, if you dont already have one, ill give you the contact info on my prop guy.

good luck and if you need any help, pm me

[npark]

Bailey knows his stuff Greg, he definitely helped me a lot. BTW the reason we are asking questions is you might find that the prop you have is good and not have to buy a new one. Ballasting is all but free and really doesnt take much time either. If you can't balance it with what you carry in the boat, go buy a couple of bags of Playsand at Home Depot to move around. Once you find the right amount of weight and the right spot(s) I'd recommend investing a little in some lead shot to replace the sand as they are smaller, cleaner and more precise. Oh yeah!! And if you put them up front by the consoles or better yet in the rod boxes you don't need as much weight as there is more counterweighting against the balance point in the boat plus it will help holeshot even more instead of slowing it down

[RISE]

Wow, now this is what I'm talking about!...You guys are great! Class is in session!
I guess I've always heard a 4 blade will be better out of the hole and provide better handling/be more stable while running, hence why I was looking at getting one.
I will have to check WP and RPMs out of the hole. PVS holes are wide open on the Fury. I've got a stock 25p and a B&B 25p Fury that Croxton worked (haven't ran the B&B Fury yet as it was from my last boat with a 200 Pro XS) that I'm thinking might be quicker out of the hole but won't get me the top end I'm looking for. Won't know until I try. I just bought some 6061 T-6 aluminum that I can build the hole shot plate out of today (great idea) and what kind of "bouncy ball" are we talking about here? It's only a 6" atlas so I don't have a ton of room in there with the pump and actuator in place. I would imagine that the addition of the bottom plate would help to begin with. Boat sits real low to water when I'm on the bow and being blown around has never really been an issue with Phoenix as a result...Now washing the back deck?...yeah, it's not the greatest with staying dry coming of pad quickly. I ran the boat with (2) 50 lb. bags of feed (one in each rod locker) during break-in, but didn't add much weight to the rear of the boat as it was sitting too low. From what I'm reading, I should be shifting some weight backwards and utilizing that level to help tame the chine and get the boat to stop digging towards port side. Not crazy about the idea of a foil, but will definitely do what I need to if necessary. Will grab some lead shot as well if moving tackle around doesn't do it. Lots to do!

[cbailey]

i have asked this question before. i was told by the man that built my boat that if trying to balance a boat, you need to place ballast as far back and as far to one side of boat as possible.Putting the weight to the outside most part of the boat is best. the farther out you put that weight, the less weight you need to balance boat which makes boat that much faster. imo, putting ballast far forward, only makes it harder for prop to hold bow up which is gonna require more positive trim to achieve the correct bow lift which will slow you down. if trying to balance from front to back, thats a different story.

Bailey knows his stuff Greg, he definitely helped me a lot. BTW the reason we are asking questions is you might find that the prop you have is good and not have to buy a new one. Ballasting is all but free and really doesnt take much time either. If you can't balance it with what you carry in the boat, go buy a couple of bags of Playsand at Home Depot to move around. Once you find the right amount of weight and the right spot(s) I'd recommend investing a little in some lead shot to replace the sand as they are smaller, cleaner and more precise. Oh yeah!! And if you put them up front by the consoles or better yet in the rod boxes you don't need as much weight as there is more counterweighting against the balance point in the boat plus it will help holeshot even more instead of slowing it down

[cbailey]

have you seen a bman foil? if not, it looks nothing like a regular foil from bass pro, academy etc. these are cool looking pieces that work very very well. the bouncy ball is about the size of a basket ball, just deflate it, put it in jackplate and air it back up. you can find them at walmart piled up in the center isles.

Wow, now this is what I'm talking about!...You guys are great! Class is in session!
I guess I've always heard a 4 blade will be better out of the hole and provide better handling/be more stable while running, hence why I was looking at getting one.
I will have to check WP and RPMs out of the hole. PVS holes are wide open on the Fury. I've got a stock 25p and a B&B 25p Fury that Croxton worked (haven't ran the B&B Fury yet as it was from my last boat with a 200 Pro XS) that I'm thinking might be quicker out of the hole but won't get me the top end I'm looking for. Won't know until I try. I just bought some 6061 T-6 aluminum that I can build the hole shot plate out of today (great idea) and what kind of "bouncy ball" are we talking about here? It's only a 6" atlas so I don't have a ton of room in there with the pump and actuator in place. I would imagine that the addition of the bottom plate would help to begin with. Boat sits real low to water when I'm on the bow and being blown around has never really been an issue with Phoenix as a result...Now washing the back deck?...yeah, it's not the greatest with staying dry coming of pad quickly. I ran the boat with (2) 50 lb. bags of feed (one in each rod locker) during break-in, but didn't add much weight to the rear of the boat as it was sitting too low. From what I'm reading, I should be shifting some weight backwards and utilizing that level to help tame the chine and get the boat to stop digging towards port side. Not crazy about the idea of a foil, but will definitely do what I need to if necessary. Will grab some lead shot as well if moving tackle around doesn't do it. Lots to do!

[cbailey]

you can also fill jackplate full of spray foam. ive done that too. use a trash bag though.

[RISE]

Great info Bailey. Thank you so very much. In going to start with the easy stuff hole shot plate, ballancing, etc. Do you guys feel like I should have the motor moved up one hole on JP? I've got to keep it so high up most of the time and feel like I'm wasting much of its usable range. Just outstanding info!!

[RISE]

have you seen a bman foil? if not, it looks nothing like a regular foil from bass pro, academy etc. these are cool looking pieces that work very very well. the bouncy ball is about the size of a basket ball, just deflate it, put it in jackplate and air it back up. you can find them at walmart piled up in the center isles.

Have not seen a Bman foil...here's the template for the hole shot plate.

[cbailey]

this is really close to what a bman foil looks like, in fact most will not be able to tell the difference. this i had made out of mirrored stainless steel and "stroker" lazer cut in the turn downs.

[cbailey]

i found a pic of when i had my blazer. its not the best pic but you can see the top on hyd plate where i boxed it in. i left enough room to allow plate to go up and down

[RISE]

Wow, very nice indeed. Do you think it would be ok to tap straight up into the edge of the bottom of the JP? (See pic) I don't have a bender so I'm limited in what I can do with the T-6 in my garage. I was thinking maybe some 12/24 stainless screws and lock washers to hold the plate in place or do I run a chance of it coming lose and really causing some damage? My only other alternative at the moment is to use some wide "L" brackets on the inside of the jack plate and then mount those to the hole shot plate.

[RISE]

Wow Bailey, your set up is just sick. Love the attention to detail.

[cbailey]

the slide master and bobs hydraulic plate i ran was wide enough to drill and tap for 1/4" so thats what i did. what ever size you use, make sure to put loctite on the bolts. i drilled straight up from bottom on mine and straight down from top