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  1. Moderator TexCaboCat's Avatar
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    #21

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Bass Counselor)

    When did I say anything about babtism and salvation? Your insinuation that I don't follow scripture is ludicris. All my foundations, truths and salvation is based on scripture, too. But of course, I don't have a true understanding of it, do I? You know me so well and refuse to see me as a brother in Christ. While I don't agree with a lot of things you teach and profess, I have know doubt of your love for Christ and consider you my brother in him even if I don't agree with everything you say. You have know idea who I am and what I believe in, but yet you question my salvation. I will leave that up to God. I am done with this.
    God bless,
    Stephen




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    #22

    Re: Fellowship among foes (TexCaboCat)

    Stephen,

    I don't get the last post you made? I hardly know anything about your beleif and was inviting you to study with me (and others who are reading). As for when you mentioned baptism see your previous post = <<<Scripture can be turned a lot of ways and believe me I can spit out many verses that might disagree with you on Baptism and several other doctrines that we each believe, but what will that lead too. My point is this. My salvation along with everyone else in this world rest on Christ and Christ alone. Not on anything I can do or have done, >>>

    Yo uahd opened the previous post with asking me to "tell us how". So in that you mentioned baptism and then with that other request I selected baptism, which something that people commonly misguided about. Are you telling me that you were only baptized as a child and because I said that then you said I was "insinuating" about you? Hoenstly, I hope you will discuss doctrine with me. I learn from others.

    Preach the Word!
    BC

  3. Moderator TexCaboCat's Avatar
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    #23

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Bass Counselor)

    Sorry for the confusing. When I made my first post I brought up baptism as something as an example that we "might" not agree on. The main question I was asking was "how do you fell I should worship". When I made my post that was what I was concentrating on. Secondly, on the insinuating, I was reading your post to Cajun where you brought up Matthew 7:22-23 and if you were saying that to Cajun then I would think you could relate that to me, also. If not then I will retract that from my post. I am not good at getting my thoughts across on the web. Let me put it this way. I "feel" that people like you tend to run around looking for the wrongs in peoples theology (according to your interpretation of scripture) instead of focusing on Making disciple's. I sent you a PM explaining a little more and feel that I am not going to get into this again. It is very burdensome and always does more damage than good, because the bottom line becomes an issue of am I or am I not saved. I ended the last time I got into this type of discussion with this. I know that I am saved because of the work I have seen Christ do in my life and the fruit that I bear through Christ. He has changed the very foundation of who I am and what I think is important. These fruits are also evident to other that knew me before I made my profession of faith to Christ. Believe me I know what "reborn" means because I have seen it with my own eyes and body. It is a miracle. This change in me had nothing to do with anything other than my acceptance for the gift Christ paid for me and asking him to save me and to be my Lord. Now the Holy of Holy's is in me where the Holy Spirit resides as it does for all who believe. We can argue about everything in between till we are blue in the face and the only one smiling is the Devil. Paul and Peter had several disagreements on how things should be done. Paul even rebuked Peter about his lack of faith, but that never changed the fact that they were both saved and loved God, it made them human and I guarantee you they did not focus on that difference. They focused on Jesus!!! Doctrines and traditions are fine (as you said if scriptural) but it all comes down to what Jesus did on the cross and I am living proof of that, as are all that are saved. Now I am really done
    God bless,
    Stephen




  4. Moderator TexCaboCat's Avatar
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    #24

    Re: Fellowship among foes (TexCaboCat)

    BC,

    Nice talking to you via PM. We agree on more things then I thought.
    God bless,
    Stephen




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    #25

    Re: Fellowship among foes (TexCaboCat)

    Yes same with me. We've made progress. Seriously, you're welcome to fish Ky Lake with me. Free room and food and boat ride.

    BC

  6. Moderator TexCaboCat's Avatar
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    #26

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Bass Counselor)

    Might have to take you up on that sometime.
    God bless,
    Stephen




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    #27

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Bass Counselor)

    Greetings,

    New here. I speak with many words. No. Seriously. I can write tooo much!

    However, the only reason I stuck around is because I saw the Spiritual Section of this site and said 'Nice!!!!!!!' I too have a web site. Nothing great. Just one I started for me to capture the things I like and enjoy and as a way to share God with people. I would love to be able to make money from it just as many people make money on their sites. But alas, it is not likely that you can make money these days by adding God to your web site. Oh well. That is just fine with me. So be it.

    But I was amazed, gladdened, joyed, etc. to see a successful site that was not affraid to incorporate God into their web design and business. I am sure this is a busines here at BBC and am happy that it is and that it has God here to!

    So, here is what I will share on this thread that has been untouched for a few days.

    -We conform to God. Not the other way around.
    -The only way to figure out how to conform is through the Word.
    -The bible is the only Word of value.
    -Men/Man will write many works on 'g'od and what it is to be a christian. However, the only Work that is worthy to learn from is the Word. A True Child of God is going to learn from a True Teacher of God and that teacher is going to use the Word, not his words.
    -We can only possibly know about our own salvation. We can never know about anothers and wether they are a True Child of God or a child of the devil. Wheat and Tares.
    -One can not and never quote too much scripture.
    -Make what you believe a product of the Word, not of your family upbringing, etc.
    -What you know today will change tomorrow if you read the Word.
    -It takes All of the word, not just some of it. The Word says a lot on many many subjects, and not until you have read all of what the Word has to say on any subject are you really close to the truth.
    -Don't stand on any one verse. See one just above. Harmonize the verses together and only then will you have truth.

    If you quote another man you will always run into problems, trouble, challenges. Quoting God Never goes wrong.

    I think the original post opened the door to talk about a lot of things and that is great. That is where teaching and learning comes from.

    Peace and Blessings.

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    #28

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Macattak1)

    Mac, I agree with you whole-heartedly. For many years I've felt that it was a mistake for someone to add verse numbers and chapter numbers to God's Holy Scriptures. It has now become much too simple to "Quote" a particular scripture rather than study it's whole. It's teachings are wonderful - but it's teachings must be taken as a whole.
    Now at 58 years old, I'm learning more now than ever before in my life.

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    #29

    Re: Fellowship among foes (sportsman)

    If there were no verse numbers and chapter headings, we would have a very difficult time taking people to specific Scriptures! I do not believe they were inspired, but they are definitely not a mistake to have!!

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    #30

    Re: Fellowship among foes (baptistpreach)

    Just curious, you said you did not believe the Scriptures were inspired, but they are definetely not a mistake to have. How do you view scripture then? As guidelines and are those guide lines inspired or what? I'm in a theology class and was studying some of the beliefs on the inerrancy subject.
    okay, okay... last cast, after this one.

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    #31

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Astro Angler)

    Please dont take this the wrong way, but you didn't read the posts very well. I don't believe the chapter and verse divisons were inspired, but they are helpful! I believe the Bible is inspired "all Scripture is given by inspiration of God..."
    Good day!

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    #32

    Re: Fellowship among foes (baptistpreach)

    Oh, gotcha! I mis understood what you were refering to, but understand now. thanks! Did you go to a baptist college out there in OK?
    okay, okay... last cast, after this one.

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    #33

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Astro Angler)

    Yes I did, I went to a small independent Baptist college in OKC

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    #34

    Re: Fellowship among foes (baptistpreach)

    I went to OBU in Shawnee...how far is that from you?
    okay, okay... last cast, after this one.

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    #35

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Astro Angler)

    Shawnee is 45 mins from OKC, but I live in Weatherford, which is an hour farther west, so just under 2 hours from Shawnee to Weatherford

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    #36

    Re: Fellowship among foes (baptistpreach)

    That's the one direction I was unable to venture to. I have a good friend who is pastor at Cherokee Hills Baptist Church there in OKC. Ray Ivey is his name...great guy. Anyways, I have fished a ton of ponds out there and love the action! Top water in late summer evenings is hard to beat!
    okay, okay... last cast, after this one.

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    #37

    Re: Fellowship among foes (Astro Angler)

    You've fished a ton of ponds in OKC? If so, if you eve need a partner let me know! I have fished 3 (in Moore) and could get access to prob 2 or 3 more, but I love to fish ponds

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    #38

    Re: Fellowship among foes (baptistpreach)

    I heard that! If I'm in your neck of the woods I'll drop you a thread on here! Good fishin till then!
    okay, okay... last cast, after this one.

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    #39

    Re: Fellowship among foes (The Original Post)

    Hi all,
    This is merely my opinion. I believe it is biblically based as I'm sure we all feel our opinions are scriptural. And truly, we must give each other room to see certain things differently. There are some essentials that historic Christianity has pretty much universally agreed on. If someone wants to divide over those things, I guess it's a matter of conscience. But, if you get a chance, I highly recommend reading Velvet Elvis by Rob Bell. His thoughts on this kind of discussion (what is truth) are especially intriguing. I'm not speaking for him of course, but I will give my interpretation of this discussion in a similar way as he does in his book. I know...some will say it's wrong to quote a human, but Paul himself said "follow me as you see me following Christ". He didn't seem to think it was all that bad to emulate people who seem to be accurately representing Jesus. By the way, it's just a side note, but God used humans to communicate His truth in the scriptures. I can't help but wonder if God can and will still speak through people. (That's a rhetorical question of course) Or... if we're supposed to automatically discount what a person says because he or she isn't God. The Bible of course, is our Litmus test for all things spoken. But I digress...

    The ultimate and guiding truth is the word of God of course. However we ALL interpret that word based on a number of factors: upbringing, church background, theological leanings, the teaching we've sat under, etc. If you say "I only follow the word", I'd say that's impossible. We all STRIVE to only follow the word as we should, but we can't help but "interpret" what we read based on sociological factors that have shaped who we are. We all HOPE and believe that we are getting it right theologically. That's the best we as flawed human beings can do. In fact, if you think about it, unless you are fluent in the original languages you are already following an interpretation of the word as best as it can be interpreted into English.

    So all that being said, in my humble OPINION, "contending for the faith" is important when dealing with people who are attacking the faith but perhaps not all that applicable in this case. Discussing differences of "interpretation" is great among Christians, but I don't think "contending for the faith" is exactly what is warranted here in this situation. I don't think bringing people outside of Christianity into the faith is what the original post was all about. Nor did it seem to be about encouraging unbiblical expressions of worship. What the author most likely meant was that we often worship God in the same way (in spirit and in truth), yet with varying styles (perhaps musical, traditional, liturgical, etc).

    In that sense, I agree with the author. As long as we worship the Lord biblically, the style or culture of the church doesn't really matter. In fact, there is no style mandated in the scripture. Style is a cultural and social issue. 'Spirit and truth' is a Biblical and spiritual issue. However, there are many that insist their "style" of worship is the only way to worship God rightly.

    I agree that the Lord celebrates diversity of style and culture. Style and culture shouldn't divide us. Instead, our common faith in One Lord and our common worship of Him "in spirit and in truth" as best as we flawed humans can understand it, should unite us because in the end, we're all on the same team. For example, an emotionally passionate Latino believer who is used to worshiping in an exuberant fashion cannot expect to go into a Chinese church and expect them to worship the same way. The cultures are too different. What is socially acceptable in one church would be completely unacceptable in the other and vice versa... yet people in both churches worship the Lord in spirit and truth. They love Him, serve Him, and follow Him, biblically (as best they can interpret such things) with their whole hearts.

    So in the end, does it matter if one church thinks it's proper to dress nice on Sundays and another doesn't? I doubt it. Does it matter if one church uses an organ and another uses a band? Probably not. Does it matter if one church believes in speaking in tongues and another doesn't? It's a very important issue to many, but in the end a doctrine of that nature isn't paramount to faith in Jesus as the One who saves. Now if a church doesn't believe Jesus atoned for our sin, that's a whole different ball game. That isn't what the author was dealing with, I'm pretty sure.

    So while I deeply respect all the "opinions" and "interpretations" here, I'd have to agree that this discussion has gotten a little off kilter at times. Why? Interpretation, background, and yes...opinion, whether we care to admit it or not. Yet in the end, the willingness on all parties to meet in a place of unity is great to see. In a way, the acceptance of one another throughout this discussion is a shining example of exactly what the author of the original post was trying to communicate. How ironic! So kudos to all who participated in this discussion.

    I know I've said a lot. I apologize for the book. As a pastor, I guess it's in my nature. :)

    God bless.
    Tom ><>

    - Tom

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    #40

    Re: Fellowship among foes (TexCaboCat)

    Excellent comments. I couldn't have said it better. I look forward to knowing you guys for all eternity.

    Peace and blessings

    Mike

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