Installing an Odyssey AGM for cranking and thinking about running a Relion HP100 in parallel with it.
This is what I'm thinking about set up. Running parallel. Hook up all accessories( graphs, pumps,poles etc.) to lithium battery. Motor only to AGM. Have a 4 bank charger now,hook 4 banks to 3 trollers and the 100hp we are talking about. Get a single bank charger for the AGM.
Does the charging scenario work properly?
Are my thoughts on the accessories and motor hook ups correct?
2016 BassCat Cougar FTD
You negate the advantage of having a dedicated electronics battery if it’s connected to the cranking battery. The whole point is that electronics are isolated. You might as well just connect them to cranking battery. Experts will chime in but IMO, you are asking for A LOT of issues. Depending on how much electronics you have to power, a good AGM has plenty of power. I’m talking about something like a $500 X2. A 31 Odyssey also should handle most electronics needs.
NoCAL
2004TR-21X/2015 250 ProXS
2B112175
New 31 Odyssey, replacing Relion HP100. Have life left in the Relion and was thinking of putting it to use,maybe it would prolong the life of AGM. Honestly was just considering not parallel and run all accessories off of the lithium, but was a little concerned of not enough longevity because there won't be any charging to it while running from spot to spot in a 10 hour day.Originally Posted by NoCAL
Relion 100ah
Helix12
Helix 10
Mega 360
Garmin 126sv
Live scope
All pumps throughout the day
No charging on this house battery from engine. Will it be enough to handle 10 hours? Maybe?
2016 BassCat Cougar FTD
I wouldn't run an AGM and lithium in parallel. Run your electronics off of the Lithium, everything else including your pumps and power poles off of the cranking battery.
Do not mix battery chemistries, voltages or capacities in a parallel application. Mixing an AGM and LiFePO4 violates all three of those.
2020 Tracker 190 TX | 115 ProXS | 4" Jackplate | Quicksilver Q4 21P Prop | Garmin Force w/MillerTech 36v-60Ah | Livescope |
YouTube - Fishing & Lithium Battery Content: https://www.youtube.com/@goodmanfishing/videos
I am running something similar, not exact though. I put a battery switch between a SLA (cranking) and a cranking rated lithium (for the graphs). Should I ever have a problem with either battery, I can turn the switch or I can run the both at the same time.
I have had no electrical interference at all when using the lithium for starting and graphs, next time I’m going double 125 Ionics and getting rid of the SLA.
If you run them in parallel get two of the same batteries. If that isn't in the card then run them stand alone one for cranking and one for electronics.
________________________________________________
2024 Phoenix 21 XE - Mercury 250 PRO XS Serial #3B429919
2017 Phoenix PHX 21 - Yamaha 250 SHO
2010 Skeeter 20i - Yamaha 250 SHO
1988 Procraft 1780 Competitor - Mercury 100
Thanks Paul, I think that's what I'm going to do!!
2016 BassCat Cougar FTD
That is a very big AGM just for starting the engine, if you have nothing else connected to it. Way overkill.
And you would not need to worry about charging it, if just the engine was connected to it. It would get fully charged from the alternator in a few minutes after starting, again, if that is all it is doing.
For a starting battery only, you just need to worry about the CCA rating. AH or capacity is not something you need to worry about.
So you could use your charger on the 3x trolling motor batteries and the Lithium electronics/accessories battery. And not worry about the charging the starter battery if, as mentioned, it is ONLY connected to the engine.
According to Mr. Goodman's calculator you'll get maybe 8hrs from the 100ah lithium. Check out his spreadsheet linked in the description in this video. It's pretty informative.
Many say don't run a lithium in parallel with your agm. They will even say never run different lithiums in parallel with each other. I have never heard anyone who says this because they did it and bad things happened. BUT I do read where people have tried it and say it works great. They say things like the lithium trickle charges the AGM, keeps it floating, like a lead battery likes to be. They also say the lithium discharges first and charges first, so it cycles alot, which is what lithiums like. Since the lithiums are lower resistance they will get more amps out of your alternator which means more running time per outboard motor running time. I plan on trying this, but i do have one big concern and that is upon starting the engine with the big inrush of current, which the lithium would try to satisfy it could exceed the BMS limit and shut down the battery. SO I was planning on using a blue sea ACR with the start interruption connection. So when the motor is started it would only be connected to the starter lead acid. But as soon as the motor is running, it would be charging mostly the lithium and a lesser amount to the lead acid battery. Then when the motor is turned off the lithium will trickle charge the lead acid while also powering my electronics. I view this as taking advantage of the experience that many 'brave' people have succesfully tried but adding a little risk mitigation by using the ACR. AND I openly admit I am not an expert here by experience, only what I have been reading about how these systems work for about 6 months now.
Ran spread sheet. If I run just graphs, I should be good for close to 10 hours.
2016 BassCat Cougar FTD
I have done it and its perfect. Mine is a Ionic 125 and Interstate AGM.
3 years now and its perfect. No graph interference, no battery issues.
When run in parallel all power comes from lithium due to higher voltage.
Have them on a switch so they charge separately.
AGMs and lithiums get along with each other very nicely.
Using a Yandina Lithium Combiner one can have the best of both worlds. Starting a motor with a lead acid battery only (lithium not in the loop) and then paralleling the lead acid battery with a lithium battery, but only while the motor is running so that both batteries can be charged by the alternator.
Lead acid battery stays fully charged which as you note is good. Lithium may or may not be fully charged which is not a problem.
If, and only if, there was to come a time when the lead acid battery could not start the motor, then the lithium can be paralleled with the lead acid battery. To either charge the lead acid battery or to help the lead acid battery start the motor.
Your other comments are spot on. Those that won't or don't, tell others not to do. Meanwhile, many others go about quietly doing what others are saying should not be done.
Why? With a Combiner, ACR, VSR they are being charged together while paralleled.
Put me down as another crazy person. I've had lead acid and Lithium in parallel, AGM and Lithium in parallel, 50ah Lithium in parallel with 125ah Lithium. No complaints, they all charged and worked as expected.
Ed R.
2006 ChampioN 198 225 Optimax
Because they charge differently. I do have an isolator but its purpose is only to provide a charge from the outboard to both AGM and lithium. When its at home I have separate chargers. Not sure if its needed but thats what I have and it works.
I put this together 3 years ago when people said you couldnt. Not a drop a power is taken from the AGM during use. I have watched this for many hours. At the time, it was said not to run a lithium on the outboard so this setup was tried as buffer.
Here is a thread from 2020. Check out the link in the first post.
https://www.bbcboards.net/showthread.php?t=1066700
Ed R.
2006 ChampioN 198 225 Optimax
For you believers in paralleling the AGM starter/house with a lithium battery. Would you just parallel directly so both batteries are cranking the engine and feeding house loads OR would you add the lithium for just the house loads and connect the two batteries together just for charging the lithium from the motor via an acr or combiner type device?
I would chose the latter.
But then I am mostly a salt water guy where being able to crank and start the motor can be more important at times.
Reply With Quote