Mercury Updated Lithium Service Bulletin 9/26/22

[fynns]

Been using Relion Batterys for going on now 4 year's now. RB100HP for the cranking 250ProXs and RB100 for the TM, no blue tooth. Quite honestly see no need for it personally. Ran mine two days without charging and could have gone farther I am sure, 8hrs each day and worked them hard.

[bloodman]

The issue is they will will honor warranty their motors with Lithium now as they may not have prior. They have control over Relion and can be sure it will not cause issues as I am sure they have tested them with their motors. The specs are good with their motors. No it is not a coincidence, but with all the other batteries out there they don’t have control, other than demand the spec’s they know work for warranty coverage are the same. JMO Bob

The real question would be if the specs they stated are actually required for safe operation of the motor or if they are because they meet the specs of their own battery so they can sell more of them. It is pretty clear to me. Not sure what to call it but I will look at some of these things differently now.

[DQM]

They were always going to honor their warranty on engines running Lithiums, unless they could reasonably conclude an issue traditionally covered under warranty was caused specifically by use of a Lithium battery and thus giving them the option to deny that specific warranty claim. And to date, as it pertains to what people report here on BBC, no on has ever stated that had a warranty claim denied for use of a Lithium battery.

But Mercury has never said that using a Lithium battery would void or invalidate your warranty. And like any manufacturer, they routinely deny warranty coverage on specific issues when they feel it is not an inherent problem with their product but end user error or wear and tear or something other than a demonstrable flaw in their product.

Since we do not all have access to the actual service bulletins, we are left with just one person's interpretation or synopsis of that bulletin.

As for Relion suddenly updating their specifications to match what their parent company has stated as required specifications to support warranty claims that have been determined to be caused by the use of Lithium batteries, welcome to the business world. There is likely some coordination between the two (ok, likely being nice, obviously there is as there should be). Thats business. Relion had advanced knowledge of the specifications, and maybe had a hand in defining them. Thats not collision, in the nefarious sense, necessarily.

Now other vendors or manufacturers have the specifications and they can decide to meet them and document it or not. Their choice.

Now, if Mercury had just come out and said Relion is the only vendor whose batteries meet some specification not made public, then there would be cause to call shenanigans :)

[KandKKustomz]

maybe we should all chip in and buy a Relion send it to Will and let him test and see if it has 800 amps for 8 sec at 20 degrees F. My money would be on a hard fail in this specific spec.

[Seaark1660]

As of 9/26/2022, Mercury has issued Service Bulletin 2022-19 stating that the listed engines will be permitted to use a Lithium Iron Phosphate Battery that is designed for engine cranking, as long as it meets the listed specifications:

-2.1L 75-115hp Fourstroke, ProXS and SeaPro Models
-3.0L 150hp Fourstroke, ProXS and SeaPro
-4.6L V8 and 3.4L V6 175-300hp Fourstroke, ProXS, SeaPro and Verado Models
-2.6L L6 200-400 Pro and Verado Models
-7.6L V12 500-600hp SeaPro and Verado Models.
-NO other engines approved at this time.

Minimum Specs Required:

-Chemistry/Format: Lithium IRON Phosphate designed for MARINE CRANKING USE.
-Minimum Cranking Amps: 800A for 8 second minimum @ 20 Degrees F
-Peak Charge Acceptance: 165A at 20-130 degrees F for one minute
-Max Charge Alternator Size: 150A at 20-130 degrees F
-Max Charge Voltage/Alternator Output: 14.8V
-Reserve Capacity (RC25 @ 80F): 135 Minutes
-Ingress Protection (IP rating): IP67 or greater.

Cautions that use at temperatures below 32F may require additional equipment such as a battery heater.

Bulletin also lists a Relion Battery that has been evaluated and meets the above requirements: RB100-HP.

So why not the Chinese 40-60 4-strokes?I ran an LBP 100AH with a Honda 50 for a year with 0 issues.Going on 2 years with Ionic 125 heated,no issues so far.

[AaronWKU]

Yes Absolutely The IONIC meets or exceeds the necessary requirements for the Mercury's

I cant find anything on the Ionic site about the following specs on the Mercury bulletin
-Peak Charge Acceptance: 165A at 20-130 degrees F for one minute
-Max Charge Alternator Size: 150A at 20-130 degrees F
-Max Charge Voltage/Alternator Output: 14.8V

[javelin90]

I use the 125AH battery on my 04 yamaha VMAX Efi and no issues at all!

[WranglerSS]

The bulletin also doesn't list the R motors.

[06x6spdGTO]

maybe we should all chip in and buy a Relion send it to Will and let him test and see if it has 800 amps for 8 sec at 20 degrees F. My money would be on a hard fail in this specific spec.

Or "chip-in" and pay Mercury to certify your battery for use on THEIR outboard to see if it meets THEIR standards for safety and reliability if its desperately desired?

Seems it is Their outboard thats propelling the boat at over 50+ MPH with electric power steering, fuel injection, and all... But if a battery has a malfunction internally (BMS, connections, etc), whom would be at fault for damage?

[bloodman]

Or "chip-in" and pay Mercury to certify your battery for use on THEIR outboard to see if it meets THEIR standards for safety and reliability if its desperately desired?

Seems it is Their outboard thats propelling the boat at over 50+ MPH with electric power steering, fuel injection, and all... But if a battery has a malfunction internally (BMS, connections, etc), whom would be at fault for damage?

They dont need to be certified. Use a Ionic 125 and your good. Haven't heard of 1 lithium starter causing problems except Relion. It would be the last brand name I would buy. If you cant see what they did here, look again.

[22RangerZ520R]

My vote would definitely be for Ionics and Andy with Drewcraft has been awesome with customer service!

I have Ionics, two 125ah parallel for cranking and electronics and three 100ah for the Ultrex. Zero issues.

[KandKKustomz]

there is zero issues with our 120 ah Impulse on Mercury outboards however based on thier specs it would not be approved nor would ionic or relion ( without changing the spec sheetto meet the criteria). Guess we will all just keep running what we know works without issue. be it ionic, impuls or something else and no worry about mercury like we have been.

[bassburch]

I'd almost expect a class action lawsuit against Mercury and/or Relion from lithium battery makers for announcing what seems to be complete BS specs. I saw these specs and literally laughed out loud.

800amps for 8 seconds is ridiculous and seems to still be based on lead acid CCA methodology in my opinion, which does not translate to lithium technology. If an engine is drawing 800 amps and not starting for 8 seconds, you have other problems on your hands not related to the battery. Simply stated, 800 amps for 8 seconds should NEVER be required to start a 3L engine.

I don't think the alternator is putting out 150AMPS either. According to merc, it's 20amp at idle at 85 amp at WOT.

According to RELION's original data sheet, the HP battery meets nearly none of Merc's specs, and they colluded to make up new specs in an attempt to unjustly exclude all other lithium battery companies.

MERC needs to come up with a new method of measuring required amps for lithium batteries, or at least better define what exactly they think is required. An independent organization needs to be testing these batteries.

Having said all this, I still use lead acid, but this is NOT a good look for Mercury!

[yam911]

I'd almost expect a class action lawsuit against Mercury and/or Relion from lithium battery makers for announcing what seems to be complete BS specs. I saw these specs and literally laughed out loud.

800amps for 8 seconds is ridiculous and seems to still be based on lead acid CCA methodology in my opinion, which does not translate to lithium technology. If an engine is drawing 800 amps and not starting for 8 seconds, you have other problems on your hands not related to the battery. Simply stated, 800 amps for 8 seconds should NEVER be required to start a 3L engine.

I don't think the alternator is putting out 150AMPS either. According to merc, it's 20amp at idle at 85 amp at WOT.

According to RELION's original data sheet, the HP battery meets nearly none of Merc's specs, and they colluded to make up new specs in an attempt to unjustly exclude all other lithium battery companies.

MERC needs to come up with a new method of measuring required amps for lithium batteries, or at least better define what exactly they think is required. An independent organization needs to be testing these batteries.

Having said all this, I still use lead acid, but this is NOT a good look for Mercury!

Don't forget the "@ 20 Degrees F" part. I love to be out on the water at 20 degrees F.

[yam911]

What size wire and what load are they using for 800 amps?

[bellaireroad]

would like to see an IP rating and the time that 900 CCA is rated for

[spell173]

Does anyone have a link to the service bulletin?

[PMantle]

Does anyone have a link to the service bulletin?

There generally isn't one. They are not published in the same way other things are such as manuals. The most common way they end up on the net is a dealer scanning and hosting one.

[bobcoy]

Don't forget the "@ 20 Degrees F" part. I love to be out on the water at 20 degrees F.

Snowmobile helmet required.( I was young then)

[bloodman]

Don't forget the "@ 20 Degrees F" part. I love to be out on the water at 20 degrees F.

lol...been out in 3 degree several time. Fun