Skeeter / ZX and Lithiums - setup changes required?

[78Staff]

Not happening immediately, but am nearing the end of the "normal" lifespan on the TM batteries in my 16 ZX225. They are a somewhat budget minded lead acid set (Continental 29's) that according to the shop usually provide 2 to 3 years before needing replacing, and I'm roughly at 2.5 years.

So, expecting they will need replacing sooner rather than later, am planning up for maybe making the switch to Lithiums this winter (well, winter for Florida, anyway :)) , likely a 3x12v 50 or 60amp setup, and maybe even a 120am cranking.

Loosing all that weight in the back, what does it affect on setup on the Skeeters? I recall pro on YT talking about Skeeters being designed for that weight of Lead Acids, and the weight loss changes the performance of the boat and may require re-propping, etc.

What changes if any has anyone had to make after switching their bug over to Lithium?

Found it... Derek Hudnall - talks about keeping two AGM cranking batteries to get back some of the weight lost by going with lithium's due to performance issues with all lithium.

[mknj671]

I went from 4 standard group 27s in my 2021 225 to a 125 starter and 3 50 Iconic lithiums. Holeshot is better but it was not bad with lead acids either, mine has a hydraulic jackplate with motor in 2 hole from top, did not lose any topend at all on my rig. For all out speed I run the plate around 16 on the gauge or high enough to get the rpms near 6k, rough water I set it to 8 or under depending on wave size. My T2 was balanced and blueprinted by Mark Croxton, not sure if that helped keep lift when weight was taken out of the rear.

[chwebmaker]

I went to three 100ah Amped LIFEPO4 batteries for the TM a few years back. Still using an AGM for the big motor. Didn't see any loss of performance for holeshot or top end speed. I highly doubt there will be any loss of performance once I go to a 125ah LIFEPO4 for the starting battery.

[78Staff]

I have Slidemaster manual jackplate which is tuned/setup pretty good currently for current setup as well as Croxton worked T1.

My Northstar AGM was acting a bit funny this week/today - never got to a full charge, just stuck at three yellow dots on the 440PC. On the water, got some low voltage warnings (<11v) when starting throughout the day - which I haven't had before. They cleared right away, just the voltage drop when cranking I guess, but just haven't had it happen before. I'm assuming due to the cranking battery not having a full charge - not sure.

Got it on the charger as soon as I got home today and has been charging for... 6-ish hours. Lead Acid Trolling motor batteries are all green, but the AGM is still only up to 3 yellow dots. Will let it go overnight, if not green tomorrow I guess I will need to get it tested. Figures, I was worried about the TM batteries, and the cranking battery starts acting up :(.

[99R93S]

I sure have a hard time believing that it would make a huge difference. I get the boats are designed a certain way for certain weight, but how much can really be factored in? I know I’m rambling out loud here but as an example….. you guys have what 20’ boats? (Sorry I’m not an expert) so you are talking possibly at any given time 1 to 50 gallons of fuel at 6lbs a gallon, so possibly almost a 300 lb swing there. Add a passenger 200 lbs. live wells full of water at 8lbs a gallon. Add some raptors or power poles and brackets. I think you see what I’m driving at here. We are talking a lot of weight potential or lack of on the back of a boat. It’s not like we have small boats, I’m sure I’m wrong but I have a hard time believing changing a couple batteries would make a drastic change to my tank of a boat lol. The smaller they get sure, obviously more change but unless your running at the top % of what your boat is truly capable of, is it a big difference or just imagined? Again I don’t know, I’m just thinking out loud.

[Fx20 2011]

I don't buy that either. I have a FX 20. I took my power pole off. I was really surprised at the total weight, the pumps alone are heavy. I noted no difference in hole shot or top end. Or if there was I surely did not notice.

[chwebmaker]

Some of the posts i've read about removing weight from the rear of the boat focus on the amount of tackle weighing down the front of the boat. I don't have an extreme amount of tackle in the front of my boat, but if you do, I guess it is possible that removing battery weight from the rear could potentially have an adverse affect. Just a thought.

[chucky6153]

My boat is proof that taking weight out of the back causes performance issues. I bought my 2020 FXR in November of 2019. After I broke it in, I could run 73.4 with 2 guys, our gear and full of fuel. My SHO would turn 5950 rpms with my hyd jackplate at 10 or 12. Fast forward to June of 2020 and I put an Ionic 125 ah cranking battery in. Couple of months later I put 3 Ionic 50 ah trolling motor batteries in. Every since then, I cant get my boat to run more that 66-68 and turn more than 5550 rpms. I've checked the hotfoot, took it to the dealer and had them go over it, I've moved gear around, I've added about 80 lbs to the back, I've had my 25t2 prop worked by Mark, I've run a flashed ECU, I've run my jackplate from 0-18 on the gauge, I've took everything out of my boat, I've ran with full fuel tanks and empty, I've ran with livewells full and empty, and I still cant get my boat to sit on pad and turn more than 5550 rpms and run more than 66-68. I had my buddy watch me run my boat from his and he says it runs flat. I have no lift.

[mknj671]

My boat is proof that taking weight out of the back causes performance issues. I bought my 2020 FXR in November of 2019. After I broke it in, I could run 73.4 with 2 guys, our gear and full of fuel. My SHO would turn 5950 rpms with my hyd jackplate at 10 or 12. Fast forward to June of 2020 and I put an Ionic 125 ah cranking battery in. Couple of months later I put 3 Ionic 50 ah trolling motor batteries in. Every since then, I cant get my boat to run more that 66-68 and turn more than 5550 rpms. I've checked the hotfoot, took it to the dealer and had them go over it, I've moved gear around, I've added about 80 lbs to the back, I've had my 25t2 prop worked by Mark, I've run a flashed ECU, I've run my jackplate from 0-18 on the gauge, I've took everything out of my boat, I've ran with full fuel tanks and empty, I've ran with livewells full and empty, and I still cant get my boat to sit on pad and turn more than 5550 rpms and run more than 66-68. I had my buddy watch me run my boat from his and he says it runs flat. I have no lift.

If you put that much weight back in and it still did not run right it makes zero sense. So we are to believe the battery shape and weight differs compared to the 80lbs you added back and that makes the difference? 5,500 is way too low RPM wise, it needs to turn close to 6K so moving up on the plate if water pressure is good would be the right way to go. Did you put lead acids back in and run the boat again? I have heard of slight variations when moving to lithium but your situation is way out in left field especially if you flashed to over 300hp and still can't spin a 25 to the Rev limiter.

[99R93S]

In response to Chucky as well I am certainly not calling you a liar or anything like that, but with all the changes and still not working it’s hard to believe it’s just the batteries. Like stated above it just doesn’t make sense. If you took the weight out then put 80lbs back and still an issue it sure seems something else has to still be off somewhere.

[garacer08]

My boat is proof that taking weight out of the back causes performance issues. I bought my 2020 FXR in November of 2019. After I broke it in, I could run 73.4 with 2 guys, our gear and full of fuel. My SHO would turn 5950 rpms with my hyd jackplate at 10 or 12. Fast forward to June of 2020 and I put an Ionic 125 ah cranking battery in. Couple of months later I put 3 Ionic 50 ah trolling motor batteries in. Every since then, I cant get my boat to run more that 66-68 and turn more than 5550 rpms. I've checked the hotfoot, took it to the dealer and had them go over it, I've moved gear around, I've added about 80 lbs to the back, I've had my 25t2 prop worked by Mark, I've run a flashed ECU, I've run my jackplate from 0-18 on the gauge, I've took everything out of my boat, I've ran with full fuel tanks and empty, I've ran with livewells full and empty, and I still cant get my boat to sit on pad and turn more than 5550 rpms and run more than 66-68. I had my buddy watch me run my boat from his and he says it runs flat. I have no lift.

I also lost 3mph after swapping out my three AGM TM batteries for 3 Ionic 100ah Lithiums. Only difference is I still turn between 5975, and 6k RPM. On the flip side, my boat will run about 2mph faster with the livewells full, or adding weight to my rear compartments. I do notice less bow lift when I’m alone. I am seriously considering installing an Atlas.

[78Staff]

Seems to be enough folks out there with some peformance/speed loss after switchng, even if "only" a couple mph. Talked to Skeeter Dealer who said one option is going up in pitch on the prop, ie from a 25 to a 26, etc - (I think that's what Huddnal wound up doing the next year when switching to all Lithium) - cheaper than an Atlas or Bobs, although in Florida a Bobs is definitely on my wanted list :).

[chucky6153]

I tried a 26t2 and my boat did not like it. Wouldnt get above 5000 rpms and only ran 62. I am going to try my buddys 24 pitch 4 blade. In response to mknj671, I've tried all the up on my plate, no I did not put lead acid or agms back in and try it. It makes zero sense to me too. I've had it looked at by the dealer and I've gone over it. We cant find anything wrong. I'm at my wits end. This did not start until June 2020 when I put the lithiums in. Before that it would turn 5950 and run 73.4

[Mark Perry]

Not just a Skeeter issue.

http://www.bbcboards.net/showthread....1183160&page=2

[mknj671]

I tried a 26t2 and my boat did not like it. Wouldnt get above 5000 rpms and only ran 62. I am going to try my buddys 24 pitch 4 blade. In response to mknj671, I've tried all the up on my plate, no I did not put lead acid or agms back in and try it. It makes zero sense to me too. I've had it looked at by the dealer and I've gone over it. We cant find anything wrong. I'm at my wits end. This did not start until June 2020 when I put the lithiums in. Before that it would turn 5950 and run 73.4

But you placed the same amount of weight back into the boat and nothing changed. Instead of spending more money on props or chasing setup the logical thing would be to put lead acids or AGM back in and try it. If the boat is back to normal sell the lithiums since they have good resale, even though some people report slight speed loss yours seems extreme.

[krindgen]

Got it on the charger as soon as I got home today and has been charging for... 6-ish hours. Lead Acid Trolling motor batteries are all green, but the AGM is still only up to 3 yellow dots. Will let it go overnight, if not green tomorrow I guess I will need to get it tested. Figures, I was worried about the TM batteries, and the cranking battery starts acting up :(.

I just experienced a totally drained X2. Left my accessory power switch on. Got down to 6V. It took me maybe 14hrs on the charger to get to 100% charge. At the start of charging my charger would recognize the battery as good for some reason so I had to cycle once or twice to keep it charging. It'll sit there at 12V for a loooong time.

[78Staff]

Yeah I got it back, it was user error mostly - I had added a TSP and in the process moved the charging lead from the main post to a side post on one of those battery post extenders from Drewcraft - I didn't think it would make a difference, but as soon as I moved the charging lead back to the primary post it was fully charged 30 min later. So I yanked that sucker off real fast lol. Still have one on the neg side, as it has way more leads than pos post (since most pos leads are going to the battery switch) so need to work out a solution for it as well. I assume I will go with something from blue sea. Need to get out there and take a good look at what I need.

[krindgen]

Yeah I got it back, it was user error mostly - I had added a TSP and in the process moved the charging lead from the main post to a side post on one of those battery post extenders from DrewTek - I didn't think it would make a difference, but as soon as I moved the charging lead back to the primary post it was fully charged 30 min later. So I yanked that sucker off real fast lol. Still have one on the neg side, as it has way more leads than pos post (since most pos leads are going to the battery switch) so need to work out a solution for it as well. I assume I will go with something from blue sea. Need to get out there and take a good look at what I need.

I'd really like to better organize my bilge wiring mess by adding a terminal board and eliminating some of the wire. I look in there and it brings out an OCD attack.

[TXSkeeterBells]

I'd really like to better organize my bilge wiring mess by adding a terminal board and eliminating some of the wire. I look in there and it brings out an OCD attack.

Same here. Its a mess back there. I'd like to put relays on all my pumps.

[TXSkeeterBells]

I tried a 26t2 and my boat did not like it. Wouldnt get above 5000 rpms and only ran 62. I am going to try my buddys 24 pitch 4 blade. In response to mknj671, I've tried all the up on my plate, no I did not put lead acid or agms back in and try it. It makes zero sense to me too. I've had it looked at by the dealer and I've gone over it. We cant find anything wrong. I'm at my wits end. This did not start until June 2020 when I put the lithiums in. Before that it would turn 5950 and run 73.4

Sounds like you have an engine issue. I'm running a FXP 26. Have not pushed it to 6k yet since I've raised my jackplate one dot because always been rough on the water every time we've been out but it cruises easy at 5k RPM at 60-62 MPH with 3 people on board.