Bass boat search revisited - battery set up question

[PMantle]

Ken Smith has a new video up about a Puma STS. They talk a little about the 12 volt set up using AGM and lithium. I am toying with the idea of doing the same so I won't be so paranoid about how much is drawing from my crank. Anyone her have some insight as to the particulars of the 12 volt setup? Product(s) used and how the leads are attached? Start at 11:40.

[TNReb]

I ordered mine with 3 12v Lithium for the trolling motor, and of course they only sell an AGM for the crank.

I also ordered the PowerPole Charge. I wasn't originally going to buy it, but it was packaged with the 3 Pro Guide 12v Lithiums for a price I couldn't pass up. I even had my dealer contact his rep to confirm the price was for the 3 lithium batteries and the PowerPole Charge. He said it was, but in the back of my mind I have some fear that the boat is going to show up with no PowerPole Charge.

I'm planning on running four 12" graphs and one 9" with Mega 360 and LiveScope. I'm worried about the amount of draw on the crank battery.

I don't really want to add a 5th battery for graphs - because - what do I do about a charger? To the best of my knowledge the PowerPole Charge can't charge all 5 batteries (someone correct me if I'm wrong), and I don't want to add an additional charger. That defeats the purpose of the PowerPole Charge.

I'm wondering if it's possible to change the crank battery to a 12v Lithium, and add an extra 12v Lithium for graphs - wiring the two in parallel. Could I then charge both batteries with one "bank" of the PowerPole Charge?


EDIT: Back to your question (sorry - wasn't trying to hijack your thread)

Ionics are great batteries. I had them in my 2016 Cougar before I sold it. I ran a 125AH as my crank battery (with a 2019 Mercury Four Stroke) with no problems. Obviously BassCat has their reasons for not selling the boats with lithium cranking batteries. Lots of people do it with no issues.

Lots of people would rather have three 12v batteries in series for the trolling motor instead of a single 36v. If one goes dead, you still have two left while you get the 3rd replaced. I can see some value to that, but for the average joe fisherman, it may not be an issue. If I were a pro who depended on being on the water almost daily, I can see the value of three 12v.

Other than that, I'm not entirely sure I've wrapped my head around what he's doing with the two 12v.

[Bass Cat Boats]

As long as they used the 2023 pricing then the Power Pole Charge unit is on the pricing with Pro Guide Lithium batteries. The Power Pole Charge unit did significantly increase in price this year over 2022.

[Bass Cat Boats]

If you go five batteries, then you need a fifth charge option.

[PMantle]

If you go five batteries, then you need a fifth charge option.

People are somehow charging two off of one bank. "Add a battery" thingie or some Yandina product. I guess i was wondering if this guy was using a system like that.

[BASStex1988]

I run a agm cranking.
2 36/40ah for trolling motor
1 16v 100ah battery for all my electronics.

everything is powerhouse lithium other than the cranking. If you would like to chat about it feel free to message me.

[TNReb]

As long as they used the 2023 pricing then the Power Pole Charge unit is on the pricing with Pro Guide Lithium batteries. The Power Pole Charge unit did significantly increase in price this year over 2022.

The "overall" price was at 2023 pricing, but I can't be sure each individual line item on the paper I have was at 2023 pricing. It may have been one of those things where the 2023 pricing wasn't in the "system" yet, but he talked to his rep and knew what to expect and made the necessary bottom-line adjustment. I trust my dealer immensely, so I'm sure it will all work out.

If you go five batteries, then you need a fifth charge option.

That's what I assumed. I'll stick with the 4 batteries. I'm sure it'll be enough for my needs.

[Redngoo]

I added a 12v house battery early in the year. I added a true Victron battery isolater for a supplemental on water charge. Charges safely. No regrets. Has work flawless. Amazing how much less my juice agm use know.

[toledobasser]

People are somehow charging two off of one bank. "Add a battery" thingie or some Yandina product. I guess i was wondering if this guy was using a system like that.

I believe in Ken’s video it was said that he was running the AGM cranking battery and the 12 volt lithium battery for electronics in parallel. That way the engine’s alternator is charging those 2 batteries when the engine is running and one bank of the charger charges both when using the charger. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong. I only watched the video once and didn’t pay a lot of attention to the battery part since I can’t afford lithiums.

[figueira]

I have a 2008 cougar and run 3 40AH for the ultrex
One 100AH for the Active target 2 helix and power poles
A group 31 AGM for the motor
Fish tourneys almost every weekend
Still not gone bellow 55% on the trolling motor

[PMantle]

I believe in Ken’s video it was said that he was running the AGM cranking battery and the 12 volt lithium battery for electronics in parallel. That way the engine’s alternator is charging those 2 batteries when the engine is running and one bank of the charger charges both when using the charger. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong. I only watched the video once and didn’t pay a lot of attention to the battery part since I can’t afford lithiums.

Right, and that is what I am asking about. I wish they would have gone in deeper on the connections and products used.

[mactlman]

Right, and that is what I am asking about. I wish they would have gone in deeper on the connections and products used.

email him or direct message him he is on here and likely will answer you back quickly

[Impulse Lithium]

If you're looking for Lithium, give me a call and we can get you a system that fits what you need, we do offer BBC Member discounts

Bill

205-965-8436

[PMantle]

email him or direct message him he is on here and likely will answer you back quickly

I asked in the comments. Hoping he responds there.

[proptwister]

I run a agm cranking.
2 36/40ah for trolling motor
1 16v 100ah battery for all my electronics.

everything is powerhouse lithium other than the cranking. If you would like to chat about it feel free to message me.

This is what I've been running on my 18' Lynx from day one, only I'm using a lithium for the start battery. Lithium Pro.

Race-style start battery, 100 ah house battery for the graphs, 2 36/40ah in parallel for the TM. Stealth charge-on-the-fly charger.

Zero problems.

[TNReb]

I believe in Ken’s video it was said that he was running the AGM cranking battery and the 12 volt lithium battery for electronics in parallel. That way the engine’s alternator is charging those 2 batteries when the engine is running and one bank of the charger charges both when using the charger. Somebody correct me if I’m wrong. I only watched the video once and didn’t pay a lot of attention to the battery part since I can’t afford lithiums.

This isn't directly related to Kens video, but Scott at The Bass Tank told me today that if I run two identical batteries in parallel I could charge them with the same bank of my PowerPole Charge.

[Bass Cat Boats]

in theory that’s correct, though we would verify that with Power Pole as their charger has a lot of diagnostic guards.

This isn't directly related to Kens video, but Scott at The Bass Tank told me today that if I run two identical batteries in parallel I could charge them with the same bank of my PowerPole Charge.

[TNReb]

in theory that’s correct, though we would verify that with Power Pole as their charger has a lot of diagnostic guards.

Good point. I emailed PowerPole. I'll post their reply here when I hear something back.

[TNReb]

Good point. I emailed PowerPole. I'll post their reply here when I hear something back.

I emailed PowerPole:

My boat has four batteries with a PowerPole Charge - one 12v crank battery and three 12v trolling motor batteries in series.

If I add another crank battery and wire it in parallel, can the PowerPole Charge system maintain both batteries on the same "bank"? Will the PowerPole Charge simply see this as a single battery?

Are there any limitations to the maximum parallel capacity of the batteries with PowerPole Charge? Are there any specific configuration changes I need to make?

Does it make any difference (to the PowerPole Charge) if the crank batteries are AGM or Lithium? (they will be identical - I'm just trying to evaluate which batteries I want to purchase).

PowerPole replied:

You can add another cranking battery in parallel but they would need to be the same type of batteries. It will see them as one battery. You would need to add up the amp hours when you configure your batteries in the C-monster app. It wouldn’t make a difference if they’re Lithium or AGM but to my understanding most motor manufacturers don’t recommend using Lithiums batteries on the cranking end.

I also emailed Pro Guide to see if they had a lithium battery that was intended for cranking.

Matt replied:

For the cranking/electronics application you would want the 31M100-DP! And yes sir, they are safe to parallel up to 3!
There will always be some hesitation on lithium in the cranking application and it comes down to education and having the right product in place! I have had the 31M100-DP paralleled in my boat all season and we have 6 other pros from BPT, Elite Series, and NPFL running them too without problem. I also have a guide on Table Rock that is running just a single with 4 Solix 12s, Mega 360, Mega Live, and a turret. He’s also running the Charge and it’s working great with it!


I wouldn’t release a product we aren’t confident in performing and I know 2 of the 31M100-DP paralleled would be great for you.

I'm just sharing the little bit of information I've gotten from research.

My dealer told me that lithiums VOID the warranty. Per the John Crews video he posted in January, there was a service bulletin from Mercury via Rick which implied that the warranty wasn't voided, but they could deny any claims if the damage was deemed to have occurred from the battery. There's a lot of misinformation floating around, and it's aggravating that Mercury doesn't make a clear statement easily available to the average joe.

I know it's still muddy water with Mercury. I get it. They probably have no desire to say "Pro Guide batteries are certified, but brand X isn't."

[Bass Cat Boats]

It’s not Mercury that is grey. It the various qualities of BMS units for controlling the battery. Without calling out certain battery manufacturers and creating drama, they leave themselves the option.