Sorting out Carbon Installs... finally pulled the units

[78Staff]

@NoCal - thanks. And as it usually happens, once I make a plan it changes... although this is a change for the good. Now have an HDS Live 12 coming. So will go ahead and move the 9" down to the lower mount (and maybe make a damn decision on the foot switches lol)

Originally was planning on moving existing 12" Carbon from console to bow and installing Live 12" on Console, but have also been advised to put the Live on the bow for better Active Targert views... so another decision to make.

Leaning toward putting on the console. Currently running LSS-2 and an in-hull, have 3DSS setup coming as I was originally planning on putting the Live on the console so figured I would replace the LSS-2. But if I put the Live on the bow instead for Active Target... well I guess I can still upgrade the LSS2 to the 3DSS setup with the Carbon on the console.

May have a 3n1 coming also, haven't heard back from the guy. Don't think I really need it now that I found the 3DSS kit, but I committed to it... Maybe I'll sling it off the bottom of the Fortex, or keep for a spare or something...

[NoCAL]

You’ll be happy with 3D. Put the AI on the Fortrex

[78Staff]

Ok switched the 9" to the lower mount - still much higher than Skeeter's flush mount . upper mount waiting on the 12" to arrive.

Took some pics of the Carbon/PS mount as promised, although I suspect it looks very much like any other 12" console mount :). Didn't hook everything up just for the pic, and TBH I may put the 12" LIVE there anyway and move the 12" Carbon to the front.


@NoCal, this should be right up your alley :). Thinking about my connections, I understand the 3DSS is also a hub?

So lets see...

SS3D transducer to SS3D Module/Hub
Hub to Console 12 eth port 1
Console 12 eth port 2 to Bow 9 eth port 1 (existing cabling)
Bow 9 eth port 2 to Bow 12 eth port 1
Bow 12 eth port 2 to Active Target Module (existing cabling)
AT Module to AT Transducer (existing cabling - not import for the discussion but wanted to complete the thought process...)

hmm... so maybe I won't need the extra hub connections. Unless I am missing something. Not sure if port eth 1/2 makes a difference for connections, ie like the dual transducer connections. Ie should AT always be on port 1 or anything like that.

Also have all units on Nema 2k as well. That one was pretty straightforward. :).

pics...







BTW those velcro straps are the ones you get at Lowes, 2 for$5.99 or something like that, and they are damn near worthless. I can't see them lasting more than a month or two . BoatXFX straps ordered.

[Moonlighter]

After you have all the new displays etc installed, Id suggest turn then all on plus the engine, and then running an auto configure for network data sources. Thus will help ensure that all devices recognise each other and that all data sources are set to look at the right places. I always do this procedure after changing/adding/deleting any NMEA2000 devices.

I also often fixes data that is mysteriously missing when it should be/was there previously.

• menu/settings/network
• then select Auto Configure. It will pop up a warning to tell you to make sure ALL DEVICES attached to the N2K network are turned on before proceeding.
• Then Proceed. Done.

[78Staff]

Looking at several SS3D install vids - most seem to connect both head units (in a 2 head unit install) to the hub via ethernet, vs say running cable from console unit to bow unit. Is there any advantage to running them through the hub? At least one unit (Console Unit) would need to be connected of course, but my plan was to use my existing ethernet run from console to bow units and bow unit to AT module, and not really utilize the ethernet hub (other than the single connection to the console unit) - unless there is a reason to? Would it provide better performance than the daisy chain method we normally use without a hub?

Planned cabling:

Hub to Console 12 eth port 1
Console 12 eth port 2 to Bow 9 eth port 1 (existing cabling)
Bow 9 eth port 2 to Bow 12 eth port 1
Bow 12 eth port 2 to Active Target Module (existing cabling)

[78Staff]

Ok HDS Live 12 will be here today or tomorrow, so moving the Carbon 12 up front. Essentially going to use the existing Carbon 9 wiring/plugs/etc for it, quick and simple. So, for the (new) 9" wiring, I've added Nema and ethernet connections, as well as power of course.

Let's talk about this yellow wire. I get that it's a wake up, but do I need it connected on every device? Currently the console unit power plug has it connected, and the existing bow unit power plug and Active Target power all have the yellow wires connected. I mean how many wake up signals do you need lol, unless I am mis-understanding the purpose.

I guess, since the bow 12" which is also going to be connected to the AT module and both have yellow wires connected to ACC power, do I also need to connect the Carbon 9 yellow wire as well? The 9" will be strictly mapping/waypoints for now, with the Fortrex US2 connected for backup, but will be using AT on 12" primarily. I could just add it into the existing two yellow wires easily enough, just not sure if actually necessary. Or just run it with the red power wire - I've heard folks just do that as well?

I have Sea Clear harness etc coming so will re-wire all this anyway, but want to get all this connected and tested and working so I can use over the next couple weeks until I plan out the re-wire job :).

[mikeky]

The AT yellow only needs to connect to 1 unit, preferably to the one you will use to view it on. Many recommend to switch the yellow wire, I bought a lighted round rocker switch at Autozone and mounted it in my bow panel.

[78Staff]

The AT yellow only needs to connect to 1 unit, preferably to the one you will use to view it on. Many recommend to switch the yellow wire, I bought a lighted round rocker switch at Autozone and mounted it in my bow panel.

Cool, I will leave it (Carbon 9 yellow wire) alone for now then, the Carbon 12 yellow is connected, as well as the AT module. The wiring harness arrived today, so will be replacing everything in the next week or two anyway, but just want to get the system up and running to play with this weekend :).

[NoCAL]

just to put another twist on your plans, you could also run the AT module Ethernet to the 3D module. Of course the module would have to be on for the AT to be visible but it would save a port on one of the units.

NoCAL

[78Staff]

��

Ok, so now you confused me :) So instead of plugging AT module into unit at bow, just plug it into the hub instead?. (convenient, since they will most like be right next to eachother in the rod locker). But how would the 12" Carbon at the bow see it, since it's not plugged into the hub. Would it see it via ethernet connection from Hub > Console 12" > Bow unit? Or would I also have to connect the bow unit into the hub as well?

For now (since I don't have 3DSS setup installed), I will go with original plan. but I could see above scenario being useful if I add a 2nd unit at the console down the road...

[NoCAL]

Ethernet is daisy chain. I assumed you have the bow units connected. As long as one goes to the module and AT goes to the module, all connected devices can see it. It’s more convenient because they are right next to each other and saves a port on one of the units.

[78Staff]

Ethernet is daisy chain. I assumed you have the bow units connected. As long as one goes to the module and AT goes to the module, all connected devices can see it. It’s more convenient because they are right next to each other and saves a port on one of the units.

Makes sense - I do have run from console unit to bow unit now and will look at setting it up with the hub when I install SS3D and rewire the electronics... thanks.

[78Staff]

And, as usually seems to happen - best laid plans go awry. Although, not really a bad thing here...

Was all setup to put the Live 12 on the console, but ran into two issues. For one, my Thru-hull is a 7 pin, and will need a 7 to 9 adapter. Hard to find on a Friday night lol. 2nd, the Precision Sonar Console mount doesn't really fit the extra Live width well. Setting the smart brackets wide enough for the Live places them over the console mounting screws. While technically it does work, it puts the bracket at an odd angle and is no longer flush to the mounting plate.

So, I moved the Live 12 to the front, and am just keeping the Carbon 12 on the console. Which is not the worst thing in the world since the whole point of adding another 12 was for getting a larger screen for Active Target - and according to Jones TM the Live will show a cleaner/nicer screen with AT vs the Carbon.

Couple things...
Man that 9" looks really small next to the 12 now lol...
I will need to order a BBT Live 12 bracket - the oem bracket is noticeably... flexy ;(.

Got the pole buttons installed, finally decided on either side of the TM pedal.

That's pretty much it for projects today - will be on the water this weekend braving the crowds testing everything out :).




Mounting the Live, brackets would have have to be moved to the right (and left, both sides essentially) and on top of the mounting screw circled. I could remove the little decorative cap, but the pan head would still interfere.

[78Staff]

You’ll be happy with 3D. Put the AI on the Fortrex

Mounted the 3n1 on the Fortrex today, ready for testing all kinds of new stuff on the water tomorrow - Live 12", C-Map shading, 3n1 at bow, etc...

Wasn't really sure about how to run two transducer cables (since I already have AT on TM), but ran it up with some DD26 cable routing do-hickies... have room to adjust. As for running back down to the unit, I see some are running along the base of the mount (silver part), some running along the TM pedal cable. Since a temporary install while I figure out the best way to do it I just used some adhesive cable clips along the silver section, being careful to avoid pinch points. Once I finalize cable routing I switch to better mounting clips :).

Mounting the Transducer itself was a bit tricky (or maybe not, maybe just because it's my first time mounting one on a TM) but it kept wanting to shift as I tightened it down, but I think I got it pretty level.

[78Staff]

Shoot now that I look at that pic, I bet I was supposed to run the cable back through the mount and out that little hole on the side? On the Comfortroll website though they show it running out the back and up like I have run now. But that version didn't have the notch, I think it was a prototype...

[78Staff]

Finally got out on the water today - that HDS 12 makes all the difference up front with AT

However, the fact that it was out of alignment with the other unit drove me bonkers all day... I almost remounted everything out there on the water lol. But I waited until I got home and it was a simple fix/adjustment.



I also enjoyed using the 3n1 also, even though it was on the 9" (for 2d mainly, but I pulled up DI/SI and played with them as well) - thanks to @NoCal for suggesting I put it on the TM vs just keeping it as a spare. Essentially I am running the views in the pic mostly, AT on top and Map/2D split on bottom.

But does bring up a question (of course :))- so I have existing AT transducer cable from previous owner install (although a shop did the work) basically running down zip tied to the TM cables and then entering bow along with TM power cables in the pedal recess. Was looking at pushing the 3n1 cable through there also but it's just too small. So will either need to open it up, or add another hole. I believe it is the standard Skeeter install with Perko chrome teardrop hole cover.

Does running AT transducer cable alongside TM cables and other transducer cables cause any interference issues? Simplest would be to run the new 3n1 transducer cable alongside the existing AT cable, ie down the TM cable to the pedal. Or should they be separate from the TM cable, or separate from each other, etc?

Do I need to do anything/worry about the US2 transducer in the Fortrex no longer being used? I've got the cable coiled up under the bow panel but not connected to anything.

[78Staff]

PS and I already hate that damn Troll Jacket Seems like I've replaced pretty much every T&H item I've bought for this boat (other than the Loc-R-Bar). The velcro is cheap and the printing is already getting sticky, and it's starting to fade/turn purple after only a few days on the water.

Have the Dura-Wrap version already coming to replace it.

[NoCAL]

Running transducer cables next to each other shouldn’t be an issue as far as electrical or acoustic interference

[78Staff]

Running transducer cables next to each other shouldn’t be an issue as far as electrical or acoustic interference

Good to know, thanks - that will make it simpler. Going to see if I can use a round file to open up the existing hole a bit to get the 3n1 plug through, instead of drilling an entire new hole.

I saw a YT vid where the guy that does the Sea Clear Harness's (Nathan I think) was doing an AT install on a boat, and he just ran the AT cable through the center hole in a BBT dual stack mount (which I also have) then back to the AT box in the rod locker. So that is also an option I suppose, moving one or both transducer cables to that entry point instead of opening up the existing hole in the foot pedal recess with a file or drill...




Starting to come together. 3DSS kit should be here this week, so will be replacing the LSS-2 on the transom. Would be super cool if I can use the same bracket though.

Will likely install the Sea Clear harness at the same time, and also have a Tournament Saver Pro switch to install on the batteries as well. More boat projects :).

[78Staff]

After you have all the new displays etc installed, Id suggest turn then all on plus the engine, and then running an auto configure for network data sources. Thus will help ensure that all devices recognise each other and that all data sources are set to look at the right places. I always do this procedure after changing/adding/deleting any NMEA2000 devices.

I also often fixes data that is mysteriously missing when it should be/was there previously.

• menu/settings/network
• then select Auto Configure. It will pop up a warning to tell you to make sure ALL DEVICES attached to the N2K network are turned on before proceeding.
• Then Proceed. Done.

Meant to respond to this, was on water today and did the auto configure, it found all devices without issue, including the Yamaha. So do have motor data, some but not all - I do have hours, voltages, engine temp, stuff like that, but do not have trim (as already discussed), or load and a few other that might require custom/special sensors and what not.