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  1. #1
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    Wind knots on spinning tackle guides problem

    I have been using spinning tackle for years and know how to correctly spool the line and not overfill the reels using mono line and medium action rods with larger guides. Now I am going mostly to braid with a fluoro leader for better sensitivity, longer lasting, high-vis, and less loops, but I am having huge problems with the braided line having wind knots form on the first guide and complety stop the cast. Most of my fishing is with soft plastics around docks, skipping docks and around other shallow water cover. The line just ties itself into a knot on the first guide and occasionally on the second guide.

    The only things that I have found to help this problem are two things: 1. Using a rod that has the larger guides (some companies have gone to the smaller cheaper guides) seems to help. 2. Also going to a shorter leader (one that the knot is located between the first guide and the reel instead of several wraps into the reel. I normally use 12 lb fluoro leader and 15-20 lb braid on a size 30-35 reel. I have tried various braids both stiff and limp and do not see much difference in these knots forming on the first or second guides.

    Any suggestions or help would be appreciated. Thanks.

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    #2
    That blow-by knot is the bane of braid to fluoro on spinning setups. You've figured out the only thing that helps - keeping the knot between reel and stripper guide or entirely outside of the rod and using larger guides.

    The only other thing I'll mention is cutting the fluoro tag end perfectly flush on your connection knot. That applies for all the variations of Albright/Alberto knots. I did not find FG knots to perform better in that regard, in fact probably worse.

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    #3
    That's what I do and knots have never been a problem. I use the power pro if that matters.

  4. Member Walkabout7781's Avatar
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    #4
    Cannot recall EVER having a wind knot on the first (stripper) guide, but sometimes on the tip-top. I'm not sure what I'm doing different to reduce that with my casting technique, but it's getting more infrequent, so I'd say you should just keep trying and see if you can reduce it to a reasonable level of annoyance. I'd suggest avoiding overhand "Lob Casts" as a start.

    Generally, I avoid tying the leader to the mainline, and just join them with the smallest size of swivel. That's so I don't have to tie any new knots, which I can do at home, but would not try in the boat on a windy day! Leader is just a bit less than the 7' rod length, and casts are underhand pitches. That's for DS and maybe for "Free Rig", which I just tried for the first time a week or two ago. I tend to think that a 2' leader is good enough, though. Otherwise, I'll probably stick with 8 lb test monofilament for some other spinning uses, or just change to baitcaster.

    I have two DS combos...one is a baitcaster with straight 12 lb Sunline Super Natural monofilament, and it works nicely...Denali Attax 7'MH trigger stick, 7:1 Daiwa Tatula CT, 1/4 oz DS weight, 3/0 Lunker City Texposer hook...nice hook, good rod, nice line and awesome reel!

    https://www.tacklewarehouse.com/Lunk...e-LCTEXPO.html
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    #5
    Most of my casts are pretty hard skipping casts and I do have alot more problems with certain rod makers that have gone to small stripper guides.

  6. Member DrewFlu33's Avatar
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    #6
    I think that overfilling a reel can cause this. One thing that cost me a lot of money in ruined braid to learn was that what was a full spinning reel with mono is overfull with braid. Of course always being sure to close the bail by hand is important, though I'm guessing you do that already. Trying to get the line on the reel under tension is also helpful, but that can be easier said than done at times depending on technique and conditions.

    I've also noticed that certain brands of braid are more prone to this than others. It seems like the line "frays" and the knot sticks to it almost like Velcro. I say that in quotes because it's not really frayed in the way that we usually mean it when talking about fishing line, instead it's as if the strands come apart a little and tend to be grabby. This is the same type of braid that likes to stick to rough skin on fingertips that comes about in cold weather or that folks who work with their hands often have year-round. The bummer is that it seems like the smoother the line is off the spool, the more prone to this it becomes. Ardent Gliss is one example....it's suuuuper smooth and casts incredibly well, but will definitely do the fraying thing, particularly in the lighter lb test ratings.

    Have you tried going the complete opposite direction, with a significantly longer leader? I do think the worst problems result when the knot is just barely on the spool. Of course having a knot buried under several layers on the spool can create different issues.

    I actually think larger guides make it worse as it seems that allows the knot to slap around the blank more on its way out. This is probably also due to poor guide placement on factory built rods. You ever try a rod with AirWave (MicroWave) guides to see if that changes things?

    One last thing that may be helpful, or that may already be common knowledge: If you notice a loop forming on the spool, trying to pull it out normally is a recipe for disaster. Instead, if you loosen the drag and pull it out without flipping the bail, it will come right out without causing a giant mess.
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    #7
    A tip I read from Seth Feider concerning this problem with wind knots and braid is to pull a little line off the spool after each cast and closing the bail by hand each time . Also making sure no line is wrapped around the skirt of the spool that will come off the spool in a loop causing a wind knot . Since I started using these tips a lot less trouble .

    PS great idea from Drewflu33 about pulling line off the reel with a closed bail

  8. Member Quillback's Avatar
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    #8
    I have maybe had that happen once or twice (getting wrapped on the first or 2nd guide) and I fish braid to leader a lot. Maybe there is something to the "tangle free guides" you'll see some rods advertised with. I use 30 series reels quite a bit and I don't see anything wrong with your description of your set-up. Maybe give one of the rod companies a call, I have found the folks at Dobyns, ALX, and St. Croix to be willing to talk and they may have some idea on what is going on.

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    #9
    Besides closing the bail by hand and pulling line taunt before you begin reeling, the only other advice I could offer is to change the type of mainline you use. More specifically, nanofil will solve a lot of wind-knot problems. However, with that said, nanofil is not the best line choice when fishing around heavy cover and that may discourage you from using it. Nanofil is more of an open water line as the abrasion resistance is poor. Wind-knot free performance versus poor abrasion resistance, that’s the trade-off.

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    #10
    To stop the "fraying" of the mainline at the knot, try applying a drop of Loon UV Knot Sense to your knot. It locks everything together & makes a much smoother transition at the knot.

  11. Member Walkabout7781's Avatar
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    #11
    "One last thing that may be helpful, or that may already be common knowledge: If you notice a loop forming on the spool, trying to pull it out normally is a recipe for disaster. Instead, if you loosen the drag and pull it out without opening the bail, it will come right out without causing a giant mess."

    I was confused by what Drew wrote, and (I think) fixed it to make it clear...or clearer, if not clearest. At first, I thought he meant by "flipping" to close the bail, but if you don't close the bail, the drag setting doesn't matter. So, I figured that others might also find it confusing. Maybe?
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  12. Member 1BADAIR's Avatar
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    #12
    First guide as in from the reel or the tip?
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    #13
    First guide is from the reel.

  14. Member DrewFlu33's Avatar
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    #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Walkabout7781 View Post
    "One last thing that may be helpful, or that may already be common knowledge: If you notice a loop forming on the spool, trying to pull it out normally is a recipe for disaster. Instead, if you loosen the drag and pull it out without opening the bail, it will come right out without causing a giant mess."

    I was confused by what Drew wrote, and (I think) fixed it to make it clear...or clearer, if not clearest. At first, I thought he meant by "flipping" to close the bail, but if you don't close the bail, the drag setting doesn't matter. So, I figured that others might also find it confusing. Maybe?
    Yes, definitely a better way to say it. Thanks for that!

    One thing I forgot to add is that it's really important to tighten the drag back down after getting the loop out! I never thought it was possible to "blow up" a spinning reel spool like we've all blown up a casting reel spool...until my line took off swimming when I was getting a loop out and I reactively leaned into the fish. What. A. Mess.
    2011 Skeeter ZX225
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