Motorguide Xi5/Xi3 and Lowrance comm issues - Logic Analyzer - NMEA 2000

[jasonjeremiah]

I've decided to take up the mantel of attempting to fix the communication issues that plague newer Motorguide Xi5/Xi3 trolling motors and Lowrance units. I have pinpointed the issue to be the newer pinpoint GPS module being used in 2019+ models of the Xi5/Xi3 trolling motors. There was some programming change made that has lead to comm issues when speaking to the Lowrance units. Using the hand fob alone, the trolling motor works fine. It's when the trolling motor is networked to the Lowrance and user tries to follow a route or goto a waypoint that issues arise. Specifically, the trolling will not follow the route or it will get to the waypoint and start doing circles or other erratic behavior. I have tried every setting and combination of settings to make this work, but it will not. There are more than 50 people with the same issue and possibly hundreds, if not thousands. I know this as one of the members of the group was getting signatures together to attempt a class action lawsuit against the parent companies of both products. I spent more than a year trying to get Lowrance and Motorguide to come up with a solution, but as they were both working on new trolling motor technology, they refused to diagnose or provide a solution for the issue and in the end, stopped communicating altogether with myself, and others having the issue.

I gave up on complaining, attempting to diagnose and even caring about it anymore. I walked away from my boat and fishing and haven't even had the boat out of the garage for over a year and a half. In that time, I've gotten back into using my telescopes and astrophotography and have built some GPS/Wifi PCB circuits based on Homebrew/Arduino ESP32 microprocessor and was successful in creating an adapter that allows wireless and BT communication between my PC and the Goto mount of several of my telescopes. Doing this has made me think about attempting to diagnose the communication issues between the Motorguide and Lowrance products.

Based on several Youtube videos, some of which are in Spanish, I'm 99% certain this issue is related to some change made in the Pinpoint GPS module made by Motorguide. Prior to 2019, the module used had a rubber like covering and no NMEA type connectors. Trolling motors using this older GPS module have zero issues communicating with Lowrance and following routes. Sometime in late 2018 or early 2019, Motorguide started producing a new Pinpoint GPS module that has a hard plastic covering and NMEA connectors. This has been used in all Xi5's and Xi3's manufactured in 2019 + and will only partially communicate with Lowrance units. One user has successfully installed "older" Pinpoint modules on 3 different Xi5 trolling motors that previously had the newer Pinpoint modules installed and were not working properly. In one of these, the main control board had even been changed as MG thought that may be the issue. Installing an older Pinpoint module fixed the following route and goto waypoint issue that previously plagued the unit. User then put the old control board back in, and MG trolling motor and Lowrance still played nice and worked great, so it was definitely an issue in the Pinpoint module itself.

All of this tells me that there is at least partial incompatibility in the RX and TX packets being transmitted between the networked trolling motor and the Lowrance head unit. It may be something as simple as the commands being communicated as a single byte, where they should be transmitted as two bytes, or commands being echoed back to the sender. I'm wondering if the newer module has the RX/TX lines tied together? Serial commands being used may also be in an older format and coding definitions need to be defined in order to translate communication. All of this would be easy for the manufacturers of either product to diagnose with a logic analyzer and write new coding in the form of an update to fix these issues, but they've both moved on to newer technology, knowing that those of left trying to make this combo work have given up and ran out of the warranty period. I will never buy another product from either manufacturer again and know they could not care less.

What I need is a logic analyzer to plug into the NMEA 2000 network to look at the transfer packets being sent between the two and try to diagnose the discrepancy in what is being communicated and attempt to write a software update or implement a new device based on an ESP processor to do the translation TX/RX. I'm sure such an analyzer must exist. I'm wondering if it would be possible to cobble together a USB -> Serial -> NMEA connector cable of some sort to read the communication? I just get the feeling this is a simple software coding fix that if either manufacturer would seriously look into for 5 minutes (as they do have the proper tools and know the relevant coding commands) it could easily be fixed with and update. But since they will not, I would be willing to give it a go myself if I had a way to look at what's being transmitted. Anyone have any suggestions?

[mx2025]

https://navstore.com/actisense-ngt-1...interface.html

[naturenut]

I've decided to take up the mantel of attempting to fix the communication issues that plague newer Motorguide Xi5/Xi3 trolling motors and Lowrance units. I have pinpointed the issue to be the newer pinpoint GPS module being used in 2019+ models of the Xi5/Xi3 trolling motors. There was some programming change made that has lead to comm issues when speaking to the Lowrance units. Using the hand fob alone, the trolling motor works fine. It's when the trolling motor is networked to the Lowrance and user tries to follow a route or goto a waypoint that issues arise. Specifically, the trolling will not follow the route or it will get to the waypoint and start doing circles or other erratic behavior. I have tried every setting and combination of settings to make this work, but it will not. There are more than 50 people with the same issue and possibly hundreds, if not thousands. I know this as one of the members of the group was getting signatures together to attempt a class action lawsuit against the parent companies of both products. I spent more than a year trying to get Lowrance and Motorguide to come up with a solution, but as they were both working on new trolling motor technology, they refused to diagnose or provide a solution for the issue and in the end, stopped communicating altogether with myself, and others having the issue.

I gave up on complaining, attempting to diagnose and even caring about it anymore. I walked away from my boat and fishing and haven't even had the boat out of the garage for over a year and a half. In that time, I've gotten back into using my telescopes and astrophotography and have created some GPS/Wifi PCB circuits based on Homebrew/Arduino ESP32 microprocessor and was successful in creating an adapter that allows wireless and BT communication between my PC and the Goto mount of several of my telescopes. I've been interpreting communication packets between the two and writing software code that interprets and relays the communication. Doing this has made me think about attempting to diagnose the communication issues between the Motorguide and Lowrance products.

Based on several Youtube videos, some of which are in Spanish, I'm 99% certain this issue is related to some change made in the Pinpoint GPS module made by Motorguide. Prior to 2019, the module used had a rubber like covering and no NMEA type connectors. Trolling motors using this older GPS module have zero issues communicating with Lowrance and following routes. Sometime in late 2018 or early 2019, Motorguide started producing a new Pinpoint GPS module that has a hard plastic covering and NMEA connectors. This has been used in all Xi5's and Xi3's manufactured in 2019 + and will only partially communicate with Lowrance units. One user has successfully installed "older" Pinpoint modules on 3 different Xi5 trolling motors that previously had the newer Pinpoint modules installed and were not working properly. In one of these, the main control board had even been changed as MG thought that may be the issue. Installing an older Pinpoint module fixed the following route and goto waypoint issue that previously plagued the unit. User then put the old control board back in, and MG trolling motor and Lowrance still played nice and worked great, so it was definitely an issue in the Pinpoint module itself.

All of this tells me that there is at least partial incompatibility in the RX and TX packets being transmitted between the networked trolling motor and the Lowrance head unit. It may be something as simple as the commands being communicated as a single byte, where they should be transmitted as two bytes, or commands being echoed back to the sender. I'm wondering if the newer module has the RX/TX lines tied together? Serial commands being used may also be in an older format and coding definitions need to be defined in order to translate communication. All of this would be easy for the manufacturers of either product to diagnose with a logic analyzer and write new coding in the form of an update to fix these issues, but they've both moved on to newer technology, knowing that those of left trying to make this combo work have given up and ran out of the warranty period. I will never buy another product from either manufacturer again and know they could not care less.

What I need is a logic analyzer to plug into the NMEA 2000 network to look at the transfer packets being sent between the two and try to diagnose the discrepancy in what is being communicated and attempt to write a software update or implement a new device based on an ESP processor to do the translation TX/RX. I'm sure such an analyzer must exist. I'm wondering if it would be possible to cobble together a USB -> Serial -> NMEA connector cable of some sort to read the communication? I just get the feeling this is a simple software coding fix that if either manufacturer would seriously look into for 5 minutes (as they do have the proper tools and know the relevant coding commands) it could easily be fixed with and update. But since they will not, I would be willing to give it a go myself if I had a way to look at what's being transmitted. Anyone have any suggestions?

My Xi5 is older than 2019 and has had the same issues, as well I have spoken to a few TV endorsed Lowrance/MG pro's and they have told me they too have had the same issue. I need a 72" shaft so I keep hoping Lowrance will release a Ghost in 72" but I have been told they don't plan on it. I only have room in my boat for 2 12V deep cycles. So i am stuck with MG until another company comes out with a new motor with 72" shaft at 24 V with a GPS. The MG pisses me off regularily, especially when trolling and the boat does circles. Oh and it DOES IT WITH THE FOB too, not just when using the lowrance to make a trail.

[jasonjeremiah]

Apparently Motorguide has finally acknowledged the issue and is sending out update dongles to dealers as I type this. They did some beta testing with the update over the past several months and it does fix these and other issues. Have spoken to several people who had these same issues, some for over 2 years, and the updated fixed these issues. They were part of the testing group that were sent the update.

[jasonjeremiah]

My Xi5 is older than 2019 and has had the same issues, as well I have spoken to a few TV endorsed Lowrance/MG pro's and they have told me they too have had the same issue. I need a 72" shaft so I keep hoping Lowrance will release a Ghost in 72" but I have been told they don't plan on it. I only have room in my boat for 2 12V deep cycles. So i am stuck with MG until another company comes out with a new motor with 72" shaft at 24 V with a GPS. The MG pisses me off regularily, especially when trolling and the boat does circles. Oh and it DOES IT WITH THE FOB too, not just when using the lowrance to make a trail.

Well, that explains why they finally did something about it. Me and 5,000 other people have been complaining to them and Lowrance for the past 2 years and they just acted like the issue didn't exist. If it happens to an endorsed pro or two, then they DO have to acknowledge it's an issue. Sigh...

[naturenut]

Well, that explains why they finally did something about it. Me and 5,000 other people have been complaining to them and Lowrance for the past 2 years and they just acted like the issue didn't exist. If it happens to an endorsed pro or two, then they DO have to acknowledge it's an issue. Sigh...

one of the pro's just switched brands recently. He said they weren't fixing it for them either. So the issue STILL does exist.

[CowboyRulz]

I've never read such a comprehensive and thoughtful post on this or any other board. Hats off! My Xi5 seems to want to throw me in the water at times and it will probably succeed at some point. I wouldn't mind as much if it wasn't otherwise such an awesome addition to my boat. Quiet, strong, "smart". I do wish it had a better deployment design but whatever. The new dongle sounds like the key but I sure would want to hear how well it works before trying it. As you say, the engineers are likely not putting their top minions on it. I bought mine used so I guess I'd better hope there is a friendly dealer around. I'm guessing I'll get the apathetic, spirit-crushing, "What's a dongle?". BTW, where the heck would a dongle input to an Xi5?
Thanks for your work on this and I hope the TM didn't push you away from fishing. That would be a shame...tight lines, forever!

[Martyepp]

I've had mine since April, 2018, and I've had all these same issues. I have finally given up on trying to use all the fancy features. Cruise control works. Anchor mode works. It powers up and down and turns left and right. It works both with the remote and the foot pedal. I figured out how to get it to anchor on a waypoint, if I could just remember how I did it. I does communicate with my bow and console Elite 9Ti"s, but I don't rely on that feature. I had a repair shop tell me they don't try to get replacement parts for them anymore, but they will work on them if they have replacement parts they pull from the trade-ins they take in. They offered me a $200 trade-in for mine in exchange for a new Ghost. Food for thought. I refuse to let my electronics spoil my fishing anymore!

[CowboyRulz]

In case others have given up on using the cool "route" feature through your MFD...note that it will NOT go crazy at the end of a route (or any GoTO command) if you change the setting for "On arrival" from ANCHOR to STOP.

If you have a waypoint up on your device, you just select it and it will bring up a "GoTo # Waypoint" button. Selecting this should bring up a dialogue box that asks if you want to engage the Autopilot. When you select yes...off you go. IF, you choose to Anchor or Stop navigating in the middle of a route or GoTo command you have to remember to clear the previous Autopilot command using the Navigation menu button, followed by Cancel. Only then will you be free to go anywhere and the engage Autopilot box will again appear. If you don't see the engage Autpilot box, then it is stuck in the last command and ain't going anywhere. I have not been able to get the "continue/resume" navigation command to work. It's quick and only a little tedious if you can just learn how it wants you to talk to it...just like a woman.

[naturenut]

Cowboyrulz

i have done exactly what you’ve mentioned and it will still go wonky and turn into a circle. I give up! I may eventually bite the bullet on a 60” ghost knowing it’ll be coming out of the water when I’m fishing big waves in dec-March at the mouth of the Niagara river. If the ghost will at least work properly then I’ll be happy and just keep hoping eventually they decide to do a 72” shaft, which I’m doubtful will happen.

[jasonjeremiah]

Cowboyrulz

i have done exactly what you’ve mentioned and it will still go wonky and turn into a circle. I give up! I may eventually bite the bullet on a 60” ghost knowing it’ll be coming out of the water when I’m fishing big waves in dec-March at the mouth of the Niagara river. If the ghost will at least work properly then I’ll be happy and just keep hoping eventually they decide to do a 72” shaft, which I’m doubtful will happen.

Don't give up - yet! It does sound like this new update, which Motorguide is now rolling out to service centers, addresses all of these issues and more and after flashing the new firmware, the trolling motor will work exactly as it is supposed to (and should have from day one). If you're on Facebook, I would suggest joining the "Motorguide trolling motor owners" FB page. It was originally started by a fellow in Europe who was having the same Xi5 TM issues everyone else has been having. Just by word of mouth and social media, all of us who've had this issue have been able to find each other and band together in order to demand a fix and it sounds like it's finally worked. There is now over 5,000 members on that page. You'll see on the FB page several of those members were beta testers of the firmware update and have confirmed it does fix all of the issues. They also endured the frustration that you and I and many others dealt with over the past couple of years. There's no way to go back and undo all that frustration and time that could have been spent fishing rather than dicking around with electronics, but at least there's hope in moving forward that we can utilize this technology, that we spent the money on in the first place, to it's full potential.

[jasonjeremiah]

I've never read such a comprehensive and thoughtful post on this or any other board. Hats off! My Xi5 seems to want to throw me in the water at times and it will probably succeed at some point. I wouldn't mind as much if it wasn't otherwise such an awesome addition to my boat. Quiet, strong, "smart". I do wish it had a better deployment design but whatever. The new dongle sounds like the key but I sure would want to hear how well it works before trying it. As you say, the engineers are likely not putting their top minions on it. I bought mine used so I guess I'd better hope there is a friendly dealer around. I'm guessing I'll get the apathetic, spirit-crushing, "What's a dongle?". BTW, where the heck would a dongle input to an Xi5?
Thanks for your work on this and I hope the TM didn't push you away from fishing. That would be a shame...tight lines, forever!

Thanks! No, it didn't push me away from fishing but it certainly didn't encourage me to go out and fish more. It would be a lie if I said it hasn't been a thorn in my side for the past 2 years, though. Every time I go out and am not able to utilize all those cool features we were all promised, it just reopened those wounds. It also didn't help to be ignored by both manufacturers and to be told to try this and try that, when neither had a clue or concern as to what was causing the issues. I truly believe nothing would have ever been done had it not been for the united front from frustrated MG/Lowrance owners. To be quite honest, I believe the main impetus for finding a solution was due to MGs new Tour Pro having some of the same issues, so they HAD to figure out what the issue was. That, combined with the fact that sponsored pros were having issues meant they could no longer use the "stick head in sand" approach.

It was also frustrating to get on here and post about the issue and then have other people respond with what amounted to "shut up, crybaby" and "if you don't like it, just sell it and buy something else" responses. Some on here seemingly have access to so much financial resources that they can spend thousands of dollars on electronics and trolling motors and then simply sell them at an extreme loss and get something else when it doesn't work as it should. Most be a good position to be in. I'm not in that position. If you go back and look at my previous posts, shouldn't be too difficult to find the ones I'm talking about. One person had the audacity to say "sell your equipment and buy something else" when I posted about the issues I was having and MG/Lowrances' failures to do anything about it. It took all the restraint I could muster to not respond and tell that person to go f*** himself.

Then, of course, you have your Lowrance and MG fan boys (that's what they are boys, as they're posts were worded as if they came from the mouth and mind of a child - I'm so tempted to name names here) that would just crap all over you if you posted anything negative about Lowrance or MG and start talking about how many tournaments had been won using their equipment. Ironically, it's the complaints of tournament pros that more than likely provided the impetus for something to finally be done about this.

Back in the spring of 2019, I tried as best I could to get Jacob Scott to do some testing with the Lowrance and Xi3 to try and figure out what was going on. After a month or so of going back and forth, he did get an Xi3 and told me he was going to do some testing that next week and get back to me. I was getting ready to fish a tournament up in NC and was hoping to hear something back within a week or so. A few weeks went by and I had still not heard from him, so I emailed. He responded and said he was in TN working a tournament and wouldn't be able to test for another few weeks. I emailed back and basically said "I guess my tournament doesn't matter." That was almost 2 years ago to the date. Haven't heard from Jacob Scott since even though I've emailed and called him several times. I'm sure he's too busy making more Youtube videos showing the amazing things that Navico products may or may not do if you spend your hard earned money on them. I lost all respect for him and Navico after that and will NEVER buy another product they make PERIOD. I'm sure it makes no difference to them, as there'll be many others to take my place but I am one of those old school people that believes a man is only as good as his word. I'll not be giving my money to any company that makes promises and when they can't deliver on those promises, just ignores you.

BTW - the update dongle is plugged into the NMEA port of the Pinpoint gateway. This gateway is what provides the link between the Lowrance and the MG and is also what they both pointed to may be the problem for several months. That resulted in many people unnecessarily buying new gateways at $150 a pop, just to find out it still didn't work. The age old solution of "just keep throwing money at it and something will work, hopefully!"

[bloodman]

I dont blame Lowrance for this but then again, I do not know who provided Motorguide with their hardware/software. My Xi5 is a 2018 that doesnt nearly have the issues the 2019 and newer have but it still has issues that have never been resolved from introduction. I have learned these issues and work around them. It is really too bad because if it worked like they were supposed to they would be some really awesome stuff. Who is ever in charge at Motorguide should have been fired many times over. These problems have persisted since introduction in 2013.
It doesnt seem like this is Jacob Scotts problem. Its Motorguides

[CowboyRulz]

Just requested to Join the Facebook page for MG owners. I'm in! That was fast. I sure hope to gain access to a dongle. Yours and others persistence has certainly paid off...as frustrating as it has been. I did see a comment that it can be updated through an SD card on a Lowrance MFD. It seems like that is the process they used to demonstrate the upgrade to Gateway 07 software. However, I can't tell if 07 was the final, fixed version. An SD card fix would be nice as we could download them ourselves and share easily. Dongles are always a bit like having the "golden key" and can't be easily shared. I can see where this might get a little political b/w Lowrance and MG. If Lowrance allows the update through their units, does it look like they are accepting, at least partial, blame? Ugghh. No one cares. I'll keep my eyes on it BUT a big thanks to you for bringing this to the BBC communities attention. Not always the most helpful bunch but if you can sift through the turds there are some really informative gems.

[jasonjeremiah]

I dont blame Lowrance for this but then again, I do not know who provided Motorguide with their hardware/software. My Xi5 is a 2018 that doesnt nearly have the issues the 2019 and newer have but it still has issues that have never been resolved from introduction. I have learned these issues and work around them. It is really too bad because if it worked like they were supposed to they would be some really awesome stuff. Who is ever in charge at Motorguide should have been fired many times over. These problems have persisted since introduction in 2013.
It doesnt seem like this is Jacob Scotts problem. Its Motorguides

The Xi3/Xi5 networked with Lowrance electronics was a partnership by both Navico and Mercury that both companies promoted and advertised as a way to map routes and waypoints using your Lowrance depthfinder (mapped with Navionics) and then have those routes and waypoints navigated to by your Xi5/Xi3 trolling motor. Jacob Scott (Navico employee) was the mouthpiece of this entire venture, posting multiple videos of the integration of the two and how they worked together. Motorguide changed the supplier of the GPS module which effectively broke several pieces of the software communication. Motorguide (according to them) reached out to Lowrance/Navico to try and resolve the comm issues, but they failed to work with them in order to reach a resolution and basically said it wasn't their problem. Obviously it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why they did not want to work with MG anymore on resolving the comm issues. Navico, at this point, was almost finished developing their own trolling motor that would work with their finders. Why work with MG to fix this issue so it does work as advertised? Much easier just to claim ignorance and suggest you buy their trolling motor when it's available as it will, for certain, network with their finders.

I contacted Jacob Scott personally, as he was the one who was out in the public touting the combination of the two and the wonderful things they would do networked together. If you're going to put yourself out there in the public eye selling this snake oil, you better be ready and willing to face the wrath when it doesn't work. He said he would get an Xi3 and test with the Lowrance to see if he could figure out what was causing the comm issues. When no resolution was easily reached, he stopped responding. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem; plain and simple. If you're also going to publicly state the wonderful possibilities of both items when they're networked together and then run and hide when they don't work as planned, you're not just part of the problem, you are the problem! Those Jacob Scott videos were what influenced me, and I would guess, several other people to buy the Xi5/Xi3, the pinpoint gateway, and some form of a Lowrance DF (Elite Ti, Carbon, HDS, etc).

I don't like being jerked around. I'm no one's fanboy and I'm not brand loyal. Hope this clears things up for you.

[jasonjeremiah]

Just requested to Join the Facebook page for MG owners. I'm in! That was fast. I sure hope to gain access to a dongle. Yours and others persistence has certainly paid off...as frustrating as it has been. I did see a comment that it can be updated through an SD card on a Lowrance MFD. It seems like that is the process they used to demonstrate the upgrade to Gateway 07 software. However, I can't tell if 07 was the final, fixed version. An SD card fix would be nice as we could download them ourselves and share easily. Dongles are always a bit like having the "golden key" and can't be easily shared. I can see where this might get a little political b/w Lowrance and MG. If Lowrance allows the update through their units, does it look like they are accepting, at least partial, blame? Ugghh. No one cares. I'll keep my eyes on it BUT a big thanks to you for bringing this to the BBC communities attention. Not always the most helpful bunch but if you can sift through the turds there are some really informative gems.

Unfortunately, the update you're referring to is an update that simply stops the message from popping up when the trolling motor, depth finder, and NMEA network are not powered on in a certain sequence. The message says something to the effect of "An update is available for your trolling motor. Click ok to proceed." When you click OK, depth finder locks up and you have to power everything off and back on again. I don't think the Gateway 07 update fixes any of the real issues. It's my understanding the update can ONLY be done at this point through one of the dongles. It doesn't sound like MG intends to share the firmware update publicly, which is unfortunate. I can understand not wanting people to brick their TM but I would think an adequately worded disclaimer voiding them of all responsibility should take care of that. The frustrating part is that it does seem there is some favoritism already at play, as some individuals and dealers have already been sent the update dongle, while others have not even heard of it. I, for one, would love to get my hands on one. Would love to take a look at the coding change that was made to fix the compatibility issues and see if I was headed in the right direction with the software update I was writing.

[Scuirus]

Navico is still interested in Motorguide for the saltwater market, Xi3 and Xi5 are also compatibie with Simrad. If the interfacing once worked it means the interface is defined and that the implementation at the Navico side is fine. If Motorguide then changes something which causes the communication not to work anymore this is a Motorguide problem which has to be fixed by Motorguide. I suspect Motorguide has limited competency when it comes to software and NMEA 2000 communications.

[bloodman]

Navico is still interested in Motorguide for the saltwater market, Xi3 and Xi5 are also compatibie with Simrad. If the interfacing once worked it means the interface is defined and that the implementation at the Navico side is fine. If Motorguide then changes something which causes the communication not to work anymore this is a Motorguide problem which has to be fixed by Motorguide. I suspect Motorguide has limited competency when it comes to software and NMEA 2000 communications.

I suspect you may be right

[jasonjeremiah]

Navico is still interested in Motorguide for the saltwater market, Xi3 and Xi5 are also compatibie with Simrad. If the interfacing once worked it means the interface is defined and that the implementation at the Navico side is fine. If Motorguide then changes something which causes the communication not to work anymore this is a Motorguide problem which has to be fixed by Motorguide. I suspect Motorguide has limited competency when it comes to software and NMEA 2000 communications.

Unfortunately I have a Simrad up front at the trolling motor. It's the Simrad Go7, which I bought before the Lowrance and actually like better as it's total touchscreen. It doesn't work with the TM either and never has.

I would argue both companies have limited competency...

[jasonjeremiah]

Navico is still interested in Motorguide for the saltwater market, Xi3 and Xi5 are also compatibie with Simrad. If the interfacing once worked it means the interface is defined and that the implementation at the Navico side is fine. If Motorguide then changes something which causes the communication not to work anymore this is a Motorguide problem which has to be fixed by Motorguide. I suspect Motorguide has limited competency when it comes to software and NMEA 2000 communications.

Just curious, are you a programmer or coder? I had someone else just send me an update that was written to resolve the popup error stating "update required for trolling motor" (another issue which I've just ignored up until now). The update came from MG but has a SWUP file extension, which is a proprietary Simrad AC70 file extension. Starting to seem very ironic that you mentioned Simrad now. Looks to be just 14 bit serial inputs. Soon as I can cobble together a NMEA/USB/serial cable, I'm thinking I could run a Python datalogger to further look at what's being passed back and forth when the update is applied, which is done via SD card from the Lowrance/Simrad unit.