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Last edited by LennyB; 04-17-2021 at 06:09 AM.
Dozer,
This is a repost from previous discussion:
Originally Posted by godsdozer
You my friend are at least understanding the details. :) Paul, in Romans 9,10 and 11 made it clear that Gods promises to Israel HAD NOT FAILED.
OK, after having reread all 3 chapters and prayed about it, here is my take; GOD through Abraham blessed Israel, and in Isaac, a precursor to Jesus Christ, shall the seed be call, which I believe it to be the small remnant of them that did not worship baal called the 7K.
Further downfall of Israel due to not accepting Jesus as Christ, though everything the forefathers and prophets spoke of was filled by Him, so we are blessed being Gentiles that have accepted Jesus as Christ and Savior. Hence, we are made equal to Israel in the New Covenant, especially being grafted onto the vine being Christ.
Israel is brought back into revival by the 144K with a New Covenant onto them, yet all the gifts and covenant that GOD made by Himself to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob are irrevocable regardless of the sins of Israel after the forefathers.
Which brings me full circle, what age are we in??
OP why can't you just go to the Bible, JW and the Watchtower have been proven as incorrect. When exactly did forever begin?? That's rhetorical btw.
Hebrews 13:8
8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
Last edited by grandbassslayer; 01-13-2021 at 09:38 PM.
Revelation 1:8
8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
So he isn't a "mighty" God, he is Almighty God! Beginning means Beginning!
GBS,Originally Posted by grandbassslayer
That is exactly what I was presenting in the discussing of creation with the first paragraph of Genesis 1: 1 In the beginning GOD created the Heavens and the earth. There is no beginning, end time, nor limitation within this paragraph, yet GOD was extremely detailed in many other things.
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Last edited by LennyB; 04-17-2021 at 06:10 AM.
Lenny,
In life, it is easy to be right and all that which you believe and present to be so, as long as you make your own narrative including whatever you may consider as factual to fit therewith.
Once you accomplish that, all you need is to get a large group to follow that narrative, and lo and behold, you have your own 'truth', which it is getting easier and easier to do, evidently due to recent events catapulted by social media, that later are trying to stem the tide of fear mongers by cancelling platforms.
So, based on what you believe to be true, it is satan and those Christian fear mongers that are misrepresenting your narrative and believes, ultimately making you correct.
That a boy Lenny, you are right!
BTW, it is the zealous Christians' fault bringing things down is the same pretence that Caligula and Nero used on the early Christians to support the downfall of the Roman Empire, so at least you are not the first group to blame Christians falsely.
Last edited by digthemup; 01-14-2021 at 03:44 PM. Reason: spelling
Lenny you seem like a nice enough fella but you have not been able to answer our questions about time, especially how they relate to Jesus Christ. My prayer is you come to bow down to Jesus Christ by your own choosing, as we all will bow down to him one day.
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Last edited by LennyB; 04-17-2021 at 06:10 AM.
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Last edited by LennyB; 04-17-2021 at 06:10 AM.
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Last edited by LennyB; 04-17-2021 at 06:10 AM.
Dig, we are living in what the bible calls "the age to come"/ Some of us (believers in Christ) are living in the Kingdom of God, in the New Jerusalem where God dwells with His people. I know you like short answers so I will keep this short.Dozer,
This is a repost from previous discussion:
You my friend are at least understanding the details. :) Paul, in Romans 9,10 and 11 made it clear that Gods promises to Israel HAD NOT FAILED.
OK, after having reread all 3 chapters and prayed about it, here is my take; GOD through Abraham blessed Israel, and in Isaac, a precursor to Jesus Christ, shall the seed be call, which I believe it to be the small remnant of them that did not worship baal called the 7K.
Further downfall of Israel due to not accepting Jesus as Christ, though everything the forefathers and prophets spoke of was filled by Him, so we are blessed being Gentiles that have accepted Jesus as Christ and Savior. Hence, we are made equal to Israel in the New Covenant, especially being grafted onto the vine being Christ.
Israel is brought back into revival by the 144K with a New Covenant onto them, yet all the gifts and covenant that GOD made by Himself to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob are irrevocable regardless of the sins of Israel after the forefathers.
Which brings me full circle, what age are we in??
In Matthew 21 we have Jesus teaching a few parables. If you read them closely you will see who the parables were about. READ VERSE 45 it is plain and simple who Jesus was talking about. The Jews thought the Kingdom of God was going to be a physical Kingdom but that is far cry from what the bible teaches about the Kingdom of God. Even today we have many many Christians that think God will return (a third time) to set up a physical kingdom.............ugh. In Matthew 21 The tax collectors and prostitutes were ALREADY entering the Kingdom according Jesus. The religious Pharisee and Sadducee's were being kept out of the Kingdom because of their unbelief and hard hearts.
In Matthew 22 Jesus continues with the same type of parables......................The motif of the wedding is found throughout the old testament and new testament. Remember God divorced Israel for its unbelief in the OT. You have to ask yourself a couple of questions. What are the wedding parables about ? why are we called the Bride of Christ ? They tried to trap Jesus with the marriage question but I will not get into that right now.
In Matthew 23 we have Jesus giving out the woes to the scribes and Pharisees ............. Please read closely, the bible is clear.
Because of this, I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify, and others you will flog in your synagogues and persecute in town after town. 35And so upon you will come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36Truly I tell you, all these things will come upon this generation.
Then we come to Matthew 24.
The disciples asked Jesus the following questions TELL US WHEN , WHAT WILL BE THE SIGNS OF YOUR COMING AND THE END OF THE AGE ?
The word When , is a question regarding time. Signs are what to look for at Jesus' return (second appearing, Parousia) and the end of the Age was what every Jew was looking for . It was a time when God would intervene into His creation and set up the Kingdom of God.
Jesus answered each of their questions if you read closely and do not attempt to change the meaning of ordinary Greek words that were used daily by those in the first century .
I do not know who listens to my Morning Musings (if anyone LOL) . Mr. Preston has been covering the wedding motif in great detail for the last couple of weeks.
Hebrews 12:22
But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly,
Revelation 21
Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,”[a] for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband.3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.4 ‘He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death’[b] or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”
6 He said to me: “It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give water without cost from the spring of the water of life. 7 Those who are victorious will inherit all this, and I will be their God and they will be my children. 8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
The New Jerusalem, the Bride of the Lamb
9 One of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues came and said to me, “Come, I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb.” 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a mountain great and high, and showed me the Holy City, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God. 11 It shone with the glory of God, and its brilliance was like that of a very precious jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal. 12 It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates. On the gates were written the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. 13 There were three gates on the east, three on the north, three on the south and three on the west. 14 The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15 The angel who talked with me had a measuring rod of gold to measure the city, its gates and its walls. 16 The city was laid out like a square, as long as it was wide. He measured the city with the rod and found it to be 12,000 stadia[c] in length, and as wide and high as it is long. 17 The angel measured the wall using human measurement, and it was 144 cubits[d] thick.[e] 18 The wall was made of jasper, and the city of pure gold, as pure as glass. 19 The foundations of the city walls were decorated with every kind of precious stone. The first foundation was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agate, the fourth emerald, 20 the fifth onyx, the sixth ruby, the seventh chrysolite, the eighth beryl, the ninth topaz, the tenth turquoise, the eleventh jacinth, and the twelfth amethyst.[f] 21 The twelve gates were twelve pearls, each gate made of a single pearl. The great street of the city was of gold, as pure as transparent glass.
22 I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. 23 The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp. 24 The nations will walk by its light, and the kings of the earth will bring their splendor into it. 25 On no day will its gates ever be shut, for there will be no night there. 26 The glory and honor of the nations will be brought into it. 27 Nothing impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful, but only those whose names are written in the Lamb’s book of life.
This is the Good News of the Gospel!
As per the JW view.......................its really no different than what the scribes and Pharisees were looking for, a physical Utopia instead of the spiritual Kingdom Jesus and his disciples taught.
Dozer,
After having read your entire reply, I find myself perplexed that you believe that we are living in the New Jerusalem, since there is tremendous discord within, around, and toward Jerusalem even from Israel itself, yet GOD said that nations would be gathering in peace to go up to it to be with GOD day and night brothers with brothers with no need to learn of GOD, for in the New Jerusalem everyone will have the Word within them.
You make it a point of saying that you are a believer in Christ, and I can tell you without a doubt, that I am a believer of Christ, as you have noticed I have no problem to contend with those that have attempted to profane Him and His teaching, even on this forum; sadly offending even some of the brethren while being so fervent. However, I find myself in disagreement with your vision, though I am good with it, as long as once again we agree to disagree.
BTW, I want you to know that I am not looking for 'Utopia' in this world, nor a gold crown in the next; Yet, I do yearn in that day that my chores are accomplished, and my sojourn on this earth is done for mine eyes to see the face of Christ and fall on my knees before GOD praying to hear His words proclaim, well done my faithful servant. Let those words be my crown. Amen
Dig thanks for the reply.
Lenny we will just have to disagree. No one reaches those conclusion's w/o JW influence. Think about that for a minute, anyone just reading the Bible, absent JW and the Watchtower have never reached those conclusions. Its said the same yesterday, today, and forever. Yesterday and today are fixed points, forever is not. From reading all the commentaries I can't see anyone absent JW say Jesus had a "born on date".
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Last edited by LennyB; 04-17-2021 at 06:11 AM.
This is what Matt 24: 45-51 is about, which reflex the parable of the virgins.
The Unfaithful Servant Lk. 12.41-48 45 ¶ Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
46 Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he cometh shall find so doing.
47 Verily I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods.
48 But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming;
49 and shall begin to smite his fellow servants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
50 the lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,
51 and shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
In Matt 24: 1-28 speak of the Great Tribulation, and in paragraph 22 speak of the elect and the 144K. Though you have been told that the JWs are the elect and the 144K, you failed to understand that the covenant GOD made by Himself to Abraham, to Isaac, to Jacob have NOT been annulled, since GOD cannot go back on His word. Hence, 12K from each of the tribes of the Jews is the residue amounting to 144K, which there is no JW in them.
Exactly, but they read themselves into it, much like the Mormons do. Its really a PR thing, Mormon's and JW are some of the finest people you will ever meet so it makes it hard to see what's going on. I love it when Jesus is asked who he is and responds "I AM". That makes it crystal clear, mic drop, end of discussion. He doesn't even need to entertain these folks who questioned his identity, he just says "I AM". If you read the Old Testament you know who "I AM" is. Praise God! Still not sure who "I AM" is? Read Exodus 3:14.....
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