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  1. Member Tarheel14's Avatar
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    #41
    Quote Originally Posted by grandbassslayer View Post
    For those that believe water baptism is a requirement, is it fair to say that you believe you partly earned your salvation?
    Water baptism is not a work......

    It is virtually undisputed truth that man is saved by divine grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8). However, some have concluded from this fact that there is nothing that man can or must do for his salvation. It is frequently argued that "water baptism can't possibly be necessary for salvation because it is a work of man. Man is not saved by works." Such an objection however, betrays a misunderstanding of the meaning of justification by works. In recent articles, we have defined the doctrine of justification by works from the Scriptures. We have also noted that saving faith is completed by obedience (James 2:22).

    The difficulty for those who reject water baptism as essential for salvation is the multitude of passages describing its purpose and consequences. These passages clearly indicate the necessity of water baptism for salvation.

    For example, on the Day of Pentecost, the apostles taught that water baptism is "for the remission of sins" (Acts 2:38). There are some who would try to argue that the preposition "for" in this expression means "because of," a view which fits neither the normal meaning of the preposition nor harmonizes with other passages on the purpose of water baptism. The same expression "for the remission of sins" is found in Matthew 26:28; "For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." I have yet to meet anyone who argues that Jesus shed His blood "because of" the remission of sins, i.e., because sins were already remitted.

    "Men and brethren, what shall we do?" (Acts 2:37). It is amazing the apostles didn't tell these believing Jews they were already saved! Those who embrace the "saved by faith only" doctrine would have told them that. The apostles didn't pray the "sinner's prayer" with them, accepting Jesus into their lives as their personal Savior. Why can't those who claim to believe the Bible simply tell the believer today exactly what the apostles told believers on that Pentecost: "repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins"?

    Baptism in a lakeBaptism is obviously symbolic. Is it then just a "reenactment" of the believer's salvation? Although some favor this view of water baptism, such is not what the apostle Paul wrote about baptism. We are baptized "into His (Christ's) death" (Romans 6:3), "buried with Him through baptism into death" (Romans 6:4). Paul did not suggest that baptism is symbolic of the believer's salvation; he compared the believer's baptism to the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus. In baptism the sinner is "buried" with Christ, but the comparison doesn't stop there. Paul wrote, "... just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life" (vs. 4). Jesus was raised from the dead and came out of the tomb; so also the buried sinner is raised spiritually as he comes out of the water of baptism. "Newness" has reference to quality rather than time. The person who once was dead in sin has now been made alive by the working of God (Colossians 2:12).

    Paul observed that the Galatians had baptized "into" Christ (Galatians 3:27). Can anyone be saved "apart from" Christ? In the same text, he noted those who were baptized into Christ, had put on Christ. Can we be saved without "putting on" Christ?

    Saving faith is completed by obedience. Water baptism doesn't "earn" salvation any more than any other individual act of obedience causes the doer to merit salvation. In fact, the person baptized for the remission of sins is seeking the favor of God in the form of forgiveness -- hardly the action of one seeking to be justified by his own works! Water baptism, however, does serve to complete the faith of the believer (James 2:14-16).
    " A Few Good Fish"
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  2. Member Tarheel14's Avatar
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    #42
    " A Few Good Fish"
    Please check out my youtube channel
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCuuwIthNWDweOTGjtkfOVGw

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    #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarheel14 View Post
    Water baptism is not a work......
    .
    You are right that water baptism is not a work, not a prerequisite to salvation. However, if you have John 3:1-6 in whatever you read as a bible, Jesus Himself make the point of baptism very clear to Nicodemus, especially of being born again in the spirit.
    Nice, clear short answer!

    BTW, if you have the book of James in whatever you read as a bible, do yourself a great favor and read it carefully for a full explanation about faith and works.

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    #44
    Quote Originally Posted by digthemup View Post
    Dozer,
    Like I said, I did not find any biblical references, but a bunch of other references to it mostly BS and weirdo cartoon, so it is if there was not such word.

    My post #37 has the google search I found with one click of the mouse. It has 108 biblical references where the Greek word "Mello" / "μέλλωa" is used throughout the new testament.


    Definition as follows : to be, about to be


    ​ Paul said during his trial "there is "about to be" (Mello) a resurrection of the just and the unjust". The word mello has a future tense to it but no where in the NT does it equate to thousands of years. If you will read the other 100 verses where mello is used you will see clearly what Paul meant when he spoke regarding the resurrection. My post #37 that I found on a google search at the bottom of the page list each usage of the word mello. If that is too complicated to read I cant help you but hope It will help others understand .

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    #45
    Quote Originally Posted by godsdozer View Post
    My post #37 has the google search I found with one click of the mouse. It has 108 biblical references where the Greek word "Mello" / "μέλλωa" is used throughout the new testament.


    Definition as follows : to be, about to be


    ​ Paul said during his trial "there is "about to be" (Mello) a resurrection of the just and the unjust". The word mello has a future tense to it but no where in the NT does it equate to thousands of years. If you will read the other 100 verses where mello is used you will see clearly what Paul meant when he spoke regarding the resurrection. My post #37 that I found on a google search at the bottom of the page list each usage of the word mello. If that is too complicated to read I cant help you but hope It will help others understand .
    Didn't they all believe that? That doesn't mean it actually happened though- and it doesn't make them liars either. I say this as my view Dozer- not trying to start an argument- just thinking out loud.
    Last edited by grandbassslayer; 11-23-2020 at 08:28 PM.

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    #46
    Quote Originally Posted by godsdozer View Post
    My post #37 has the google search I found with one click of the mouse. It has 108 biblical references where the Greek word "Mello" / "μέλλωa" is used throughout the new testament.


    Definition as follows : to be, about to be


    ​ Paul said during his trial "there is "about to be" (Mello) a resurrection of the just and the unjust". The word mello has a future tense to it but no where in the NT does it equate to thousands of years. If you will read the other 100 verses where mello is used you will see clearly what Paul meant when he spoke regarding the resurrection. My post #37 that I found on a google search at the bottom of the page list each usage of the word mello. If that is too complicated to read I cant help you but hope It will help others understand .
    .

    I have no idea why, but I did waste more time to find this greek work 'mello', and lo and behold, I found it including the article that you cut and pasted from:

    Part One - Greek: Mello


    By Donald Hochner​




    This is the first of five articles examining the Greek words as used in the Bible. I want to share with you why the full Preterist position is consistent with the Scripture, especially these passages that speak of things about to come. We are going to look into the lexicons with the Greek word "mello" (with its root words) which means "to be about to be, to be the point of doing" (Analytical Greek Lexicon, p. 262; Arndt, p. 500; Thayer, p. 396). I think this word "mello" is one of the most neglected English translations (NASB, KJV, NIV, etc.) of the eschatological passages in the NT. I was shocked to find out about this. The English translators may be guilty of removing or distorting God's Holy Word (Deut. 4:2). I believe it is because of the futurists' views that have affected or influenced translations of the Bible. This is pure eisegesis.


    I am going to show you some eschatological passages. I am using NASB and you will see "[about]" which is in Greek text. I would recommend you to check some books in Greek and English with the interlinear translation, "The New Englishman's Concordance and Lexicon" and "Young's Literal Translation of the Holy Bible." These books may be very helpful for you. You will see why.

    BTW Derrell, I hope that you and yours have a great Thanksgiving.

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    #47
    Quote Originally Posted by digthemup View Post
    .

    I have no idea why, but I did waste more time to find this greek work 'mello', and lo and behold, I found it including the article that you cut and pasted from:

    Part One - Greek: Mello


    By Donald Hochner​




    This is the first of five articles examining the Greek words as used in the Bible. I want to share with you why the full Preterist position is consistent with the Scripture, especially these passages that speak of things about to come. We are going to look into the lexicons with the Greek word "mello" (with its root words) which means "to be about to be, to be the point of doing" (Analytical Greek Lexicon, p. 262; Arndt, p. 500; Thayer, p. 396). I think this word "mello" is one of the most neglected English translations (NASB, KJV, NIV, etc.) of the eschatological passages in the NT. I was shocked to find out about this. The English translators may be guilty of removing or distorting God's Holy Word (Deut. 4:2). I believe it is because of the futurists' views that have affected or influenced translations of the Bible. This is pure eisegesis.


    I am going to show you some eschatological passages. I am using NASB and you will see "[about]" which is in Greek text. I would recommend you to check some books in Greek and English with the interlinear translation, "The New Englishman's Concordance and Lexicon" and "Young's Literal Translation of the Holy Bible." These books may be very helpful for you. You will see why.

    BTW Derrell, I hope that you and yours have a great Thanksgiving.

    You too !

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