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    #21
    99.9999% of christians are waiting on the resurrection. And yet Paul the apostle was "on trial for his belief about the resurrection". If you study the greek language (just use a lexicon, it doesnt take a degree from a seminary) pauls use of resurrection was a "present tense". The resurrection was ongoing in Pauls lifetime.

    6And now it is because of my hope in what God has promised our ancestors that I am on trial today. 7This is the promise our twelve tribes are hoping to see fulfilled as they earnestly serve God day and night. King Agrippa, it is because of this hope that these Jews are accusing me. 8Why should any of you consider it incredible that God raises the dead?9I too was convinced that I ought to do all that was possible to oppose the name of Jesus of Nazareth.

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    #22
    The word "raises" in the above text is defined in my Logos Bible Software as follows:

    1. It is a verb. it is a word that describes a action , state of being, or the production of a result

    2. It was written in the present tense : where a writer portrays a action in process or a state of being with no assesment of the completion of the process.

    3. it is in the active voice: The mood in which the action of the verb or the state of being it describes is presented by the writer as real. It is the mood of assertion, where the writer portrays something as actual (as opposed to possible or contingent on intention). Depending on context, the writer may or may not believe the action is real, but is presenting it as real.

    4. Indicative — The mood in which the action of the verb or the state of being it describes is presented by the writer as real. It is the mood of assertion, where the writer portrays something as actual (as opposed to possible or contingent on intention).

    5. third person — In grammar, ‘person’ refers to the feature of verbs or pronouns that helps us distinguish “grammatical actors” in spoken or written communication. The “first person” points to the speaker or performer (“I”); the “second person” points to the person being addressed (“you”); and the “third person” refers to the person being spoken about (“he,” “they”)

    6. singular — Refers to one person or thing. In grammar, the feature of a word that informs whether one (singular) or more (plural) persons or things are referred to or performing an action.


    7. finite verb: A verb whose form changes to maintain consonance with its subject

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    #23
    "the dead"





    νεκρός, ά, όν
    A. as adj. (perh. as early as Hom., certainly Pind.; in Ath. only R. title)
    ① pert. to being in a state of loss of life, dead, of pers.: lit. καταπίπτειν νεκρόν fall dead Ac 28:6. ἤρθη νεκρός he was taken up dead 20:9 (another possibility is as dead, for dead: Lucian, Ver. Hist. 1, 22; Eunapius, Vi. Soph. 76 συγχωρήσατε τῷ νεκρῷ [the one who is deathly sick] με δοῦναι φάρμακον.—ἤρθη ν. as TestJud 9:3). νεκρὸς κεῖται (Mel., P. 90, 672) lies dead AcPt Ox 849 recto, 15.—Ac 5:10; Js 2:26a. ἔπεσα πρὸς τοὺς πόδας αὐτοῦ ὡς ν. I fell at his feet as if I were dead Rv 1:17 (ὡς ν. as Diod S 36, 8, 4; TestAbr A 9 p. 86, 17 [Stone p. 20]). ἐγενήθησαν ὡς νεκροί Mt 28:4. ἐγένετο ὡσεὶ νεκρός Mk 9:26. Of Christ ἐγενόμην ν. I was dead Rv 1:18; cp. 2:8.
    ② pert. to being so morally or spiritually deficient as to be in effect dead, dead, fig. ext. of 1
    ⓐ of pers. (Soph., Philoct. 1018 ἄφιλον ἔρημον ἄπολιν ἐν ζῶσιν νεκρόν; Menand., Colax 50; Epict. 3, 23, 28; schol. on Aristoph., Ran. 423 διὰ τὴν κακοπραγίαν νεκροὺς τοὺς Ἀθηναίους καλεῖ; Sextus 175 ν. παρὰ θεῷ; Philo, Leg. All. 3, 35, Conf. Lingu. 55, Fuga 56) of the prodigal son either thought to be dead, missing, or morally dead, depraved Lk 15:24, 32. Of a congregation that is inactive, remiss Rv 3:1. Of persons before baptism Hs 9, 16, 3f; 6. W. dat. of disadvantage ν. τῇ ἁμαρτίᾳ dead to sin Ro 6:11.—ἐκ νεκρῶν ζῶντας Ro 6:13; sim. on the mng. of baptism ν. τοῖς παραπτώμασιν dead in sins Eph 2:1, 5; Col 2:13. Of worldly-minded Christians: τὸ ἥμισυ ν. ἐστι Hs 8, 8, 1 v.l.
    ⓑ of things ν. ἔργα dead works that cannot bring eternal life Hb 6:1; 9:14; Hs 9, 21, 2. ἡ πίστις χωρὶς ἔργων ν. ἐστιν faith apart from deeds (i.e. without practical application) is dead, useless Js 2:26b (κενή P74), cp. vss. 17, 20 v.l. (DVerseput, Reworking the Puzzle of Faith and Deeds in Js 2:14–26: NTS 43, ’97, 97–115). Of sin χωρὶς νόμου ἁμαρτία ν. where there is no law, sin is dead, i.e. sin is not perceptible Ro 7:8 (cp. 5:20). Of the believer, in whom Christ lives: τὸ σῶμα νεκρόν the body (of σάρξ and sin) is dead 8:10 (Herm. Wr. 7, 2 visible corporeality is called ὁ αἰσθητικὸς νεκρός. Sim. Philo, Leg. All. 3, 69ff, Gig. 15).
    ③ pert. to having never been alive and lacking capacity for life, dead, lifeless (Wsd 15:5; Ar. 3:2; Just., A I, 9, 1 ἀψυχα καὶ νεκρά) of the brass serpent 12:7. Of polytheistic objects of cultic devotion PtK 2 p. 14, 21. νεκροὶ θεοί 2 Cl 3:1; D 6:3. (On the borderline between 1 and 2: τὰ μὲν ὀνόματα … θεῶν ὀνόματά ἐστιν νεκρῶν ἀνθρώπων Theoph. Ant. 1, 9 [p. 76, 8]).
    B. as subst. ὁ ν. (so mostly Hom.+; ins, pap, LXX, En 103:5; TestGad 4:6; ApcEsdr 4:36; Philo; Jos., Bell. 4, 331 al.; Ar. 15, 3; Just., Mel., Ath., R. title; Jos.)
    ① one who is no longer physically alive, dead person, a dead body, a corpse, lit. Lk 7:15; Hb 9:17; 11:35; Rv 20:5; 12:13. μακάριοι οἱ ν. οἱ ἐν κυρίῳ ἀποθνῄσκοντες 14:13; cp. 1 Th 4:16. Without art. νεκροῦ βληθέντος AcPlCor 2:32 (w. ζῶν as Appian, Liby. 129 §617 τ. νεκροὺς κ. τ. ζῶντας; Aesop, Fab. 69 H.=288 P.; EpArist 146) of God οὐκ ἔστιν (ὁ) θεὸς νεκρῶν ἀλλὰ ζώντων Mt 22:32; Mk 12:27; Lk 20:38. καὶ ν. καὶ ζώντων κυριεύειν rule over the living and the dead i.e. over all humankind past and present Ro 14:9. κρίνειν ζῶντας καὶ νεκρούς 2 Ti 4:1; 1 Pt 4:5; 7:2; κριτὴς ζώντων καὶ ν. Ac 10:42; 2 Cl 1:1; Pol 2:1. In this combination ν. without the article means all the dead, all those who are in the underworld (νεκροί=the dead: Thu. 4, 14, 5; 5, 10, 12; Lucian, Ver. Hist. 1, 39; Polyaenus 4, 2, 5). Of deceased Christians νεκροῖς εὐαγγελίσθη 1 Pt 4:6 (Selwyn, comm. 337–39). The art. can also be used without special significance: ὁ καιρὸς τῶν ν. κριθῆναι Rv 11:18; οἱ ν. ἀκούσουσιν τῆς φωνῆς τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ θεοῦ J 5:25. In prepositional phrases oft. without the art. ἐκ. ν. and ἀπὸ ν. (B-D-F §254, 2; Rob. 791f). ἐγείρειν ἐκ ν., ἐγείρεσθαι ἐκ ν. Mt 17:9; Mk 6:14; Lk 9:7; 24:46; J 2:22; 12:1, 9, 17; 21:14; Ac 3:15; 4:10; 13:30; Ro 4:24; 6:4, 9; 7:4; 8:11ab, 34 v.l.; 10:9; 1 Cor 15:12a, 20; Gal 1:1; Eph 1:20; Col 2:12; 2 Ti 2:8; Hb 11:19; 1 Pt 1:21; IMg 9:3; ITr 9:2; Pol 2:1f; 5:2; AcPlCor 2:6; 5:2. ἀναστῆναι ἐκ ν. and ἀναστῆσαί τινα ἐκ ν. (Just.; Mel., P.) Mk 9:9f; 12:25; Lk 16:31; J 20:9; Ac 10:41; 13:34; 17:3, 31; 1 Cl 24:1; 15:9; GPt 8:30 (KKuhn, NTS 7, ’61, 343f); Papias (11:3); Qua. ἡ ἐκ ν. ἀνάστασις (Mel., P. 3, 20) 5:6; Lk 20:35; Ac 4:2. Also ἡ ἐξανάστασις ἡ ἐκ ν. Phil 3:11; ζωὴ ἐκ ν. Ro 11:15; ἀνάγειν ἐκ ν. (Just., A I, 45, 1; 50, 12 al.) bring up from the realm of the dead Ro 10:7; Hb 13:20. ἀπὸ ν. πορεύεσθαι πρός τινα come up to someone fr. the realm of the dead Lk 16:30. Somet. the art. is included in these prep. combinations without appreciable difference in mng.: ἐγείρεσθαι ἀπὸ τῶν ν. Mt 14:2; 27:64; 28:7 (but ἐγείρεσθαι ἐκ ν. 17:9). ἐγείρειν ἐκ τῶν ν. 1 Th 1:10 v.l.; πρωτότοκος ἐκ τῶν ν. Col 1:18 beside ὁ πρωτότοκος τῶν ν. Rv 1:5. The art. is often omitted w. the gen.; so as a rule in ἀνάστασις ν. (Did., Gen. 96, 13) resurrection of the dead, an expr. that is explained by the locution ἀναστῆναι ἐκ ν. (also Ar. 15, 3; Just., D. 80, 4) Ac 17:32; 23:6; 24:21; 26:23; Ro 1:4; 1 Cor 15:12b, 13, 21; D 16:6. νεκροῦ ἀνάστασιν Papias (2:9). ἀνάστασις ἐκ ν. 1 Pt 1:3; ἐκ ν. ἀνάστασις AcPlCor 2:35. Also ἀνάστασις τῶν ν. Mt 22:31; 1 Cor 15:42 (Just., D. 45, 2). νεκροὺς ἐγείρειν raise the dead Mt 10:8; Ac 26:8; AcPl Ha 8, 35=BMM verso 8f. Pass. (Theoph. Ant. 1, 8 [p. 74, 6]) Mt 11:5; Lk 7:22 (cp. 4Q 521:12; on the fig. understanding s. κωφός 2); 1 Cor 15:15f, 29b, 32. Also τοὺς ν. ἐγείρειν J 5:21; 2 Cor 1:9. Pass. Mk 12:26; Lk 20:37; 1 Cor 15:35, 52. Of God ζωοποιεῖν τοὺς ν. Ro 4:17. μετὰ τῶν ν. among the dead Lk 24:5. βαπτίζεσθαι ὑπὲρ τῶν ν. be baptized for the dead 1 Cor 15:29a (s. βαπτίζω 2c; JWhite, JBL 116, 97, 487–99). τάφοι νεκρῶν IPhld 6:1. ὀστέα νεκρῶν the bones of the dead Mt 23:27. ἄτονος ὥσπερ νεκροῦ νεῦρα powerless as the sinews of a corpse Hm 12, 6, 2. αἷμα ὡς νεκροῦ blood like that of a dead person Rv 16:3.
    ② one who is so spiritually obtuse as to be in effect dead, dead pers., fig. ext. of 1 (cp. Philo, Fuga 56) ἄφες τοὺς ν. θάψαι τοὺς ἑαυτῶν ν. let the dead bury their dead of those who do not give priority to discipleship Mt 8:22; Lk 9:60 (cp. Theophyl. Sim., Ep. 25 τ. θνητοῖς τὰ θνητὰ καταλείψομεν.—FPerles, ZNW 19, 1920, 96; 25, 1926, 286f; Bleibtreu [s. μισέω 2]. AEhrhardt, Studia Theologica VI, 2, ’53, 128–64.—θάπτειν τοὺς ν. lit. Jos., Bell. 5, 518). The words ἀνάστα ἐκ τ. νεκρῶν Eph 5:14 appear to belong to a hymn (s. Rtzst., Erlösungsmyst. 1921, 136) that may have become part of the baptism ritual (MDibelius, Hdb. ad loc.; FDölger, Sol Salutis2, 1925, 364ff).—B. 290. DELG. M-M. EDNT. TW.




    Arndt, W., Danker, F. W., Bauer, W., & Gingrich, F. W. (2000). A Greek-English lexicon of the New Testament and other early Christian literature (3rd ed., pp. 667–668). Chicago: University of Chicago Press.

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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by grandbassslayer View Post
    So all the time Paul spent in the desert with God, he didn't learn anything new? What about the mysteries? I don't understand why we can't have a conversation w/o insults btw.
    If a person that is making a complete idiot of himself in public, and gets checked, would you consider it to be an insult or chastening?
    I had hoped that by now, y'all had reckoned that this troll is not a "baptist" as he claimed to be in another post, but just phishing and instigating while patting himself in the back thinking he is 'intelligent' yet only proving he is a fool.

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    #25
    Quote Originally Posted by digthemup View Post
    If a person that is making a complete idiot of himself in public, and gets checked, would you consider it to be an insult or chastening?
    I had hoped that by now, y'all had reckoned that this troll is not a "baptist" as he claimed to be in another post, but just phishing and instigating while patting himself in the back thinking he is 'intelligent' yet only proving he is a fool.
    Is this what your religion has done for you? Is this a post Jesus would make?

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    #26
    Quote Originally Posted by rexico View Post
    Is this what your religion has done for you? Is this a post Jesus would make?
    Rex,
    BTW, I had a dog named with the same name you have chosen to spew your venom, and if you were remotely a baptist as you profaned, you would have been capable to reply to your question all by your lonesome, which probably is where you are lonesome.
    Read the NT and you will find your answer as to what Jesus replied to the scribes and pharisees when they were platting to trick Him, pretty much like you are fixing to do.
    I bet you double, John the Baptizer would have wrote that statement and than some.

    Tell us guru, what has your religion done for you???
    Ohh, if you would like, you can PM me, and we can iron out whatever your issues are at a very personal level.

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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by digthemup View Post
    Rex,
    BTW, I had a dog named with the same name you have chosen to spew your venom, and if you were remotely a baptist as you profaned, you would have been capable to reply to your question all by your lonesome, which probably is where you are lonesome.
    Read the NT and you will find your answer as to what Jesus replied to the scribes and pharisees when they were platting to trick Him, pretty much like you are fixing to do.
    I bet you double, John the Baptizer would have wrote that statement and than some.

    Tell us guru, what has your religion done for you???
    Ohh, if you would like, you can PM me, and we can iron out whatever your issues are at a very personal level.
    WOW .....My venom?

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    #28
    Keep the questions coming Rexico. We don't have all the answers, heck we Christians disagree on what I call some 2nd and 3rd tier issues amongst ourselves which is ok.

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    #29
    Quote Originally Posted by rexico View Post
    WOW .....My venom?
    Rex,
    let me point out like you have done to other people, why are you avoiding my question?? or is "wow my venom" is all you have in hope to bring in others for you to hide behind in their pity.
    Just like GOD said on to Job, answer my question?

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    #30
    This thread is about two posts from being locked. Tread carefully.

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    #31
    Rexico (post 25)-- If you wear "What would Jesus do" on one wrist, its advisable to wear "What has Jesus Done" on the other wrist. Law and Gospel. In the Law category, we all fall short. Jesus lived it perfectly, we don't. Remember, we must be perfect--all the time. Oops. No one was ever saved by the Law. The Law serves as a mirror to our lives. We see our sins. The Law points us somewhere else for restoration--the Gospel. Only the Gospel can build the Church, individually and corporately. Only the Gospel can "increase the faith", by the Holy Spirit. Some get confused over what is Gospel. Its all over the Old and New Testaments. Old--predicting that Christ would someday come and restore, redeem us. New--the actual account.

    Example OT: "Who is a God like you, who pardons sin and forgives the transgression of the remnant of his inheritance? You do not stay angry forever but delight to show mercy. You will again have compassion on us; you will tread our sins underfoot and hurl all our iniquities into the depths of the sea." Micah 7: 18-19 Christ accomplished this. Other religions indeed, they have no concept of redemption by God. Unique message.

    Example NT: "Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through him! For if we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his son..." Romans 5:9ff God restores the broken relationship with man (due to sin). One of my favorite accounts in Scripture: Resurrected Jesus restores Peter after his denial of Christ. We too are restored. "Feed my sheep." John 21:15ff. John ends the Book on that note. How fitting. There is hope for us.

    Cajonbass: key word--"tread"

    Note this: Scripture is the sole norm by which all teachings are tested. That's why we quote Holy Scripture.

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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by CajunBass View Post
    This thread is about two posts from being locked. Tread carefully.
    Wayne,
    my most sincere apology to you brethren, though I asked Rex to PM me trolls never do since they can't hide behind the smoke screens any longer.
    Be safe and be blessed
    Frank

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    #33
    Ad hominem (Latin for 'to the person'), short for argumentum ad hominem, is a term that refers to several types of arguments, most of which are fallacious. Typically this term refers to a rhetorical strategy where the speaker attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself. This avoids genuine debate by creating a diversion to some irrelevant but often highly charged issue. The most common form of this fallacy is "A makes a claim x, B asserts that A holds a property that is unwelcome, and hence B concludes that argument x is wrong".

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    #34
    Darrell,
    That would be a very good observation if the matter at hand would be subjective as whether a Ranger 521 VX with 250HP would be faster than a Legend 211R with 250HP, which although the answer is obvious, it could create division yet irrelevant but very highly charged comparo.

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    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by digthemup View Post
    Wayne,
    my most sincere apology to you brethren, though I asked Rex to PM me trolls never do since they can't hide behind the smoke screens any longer.
    Be safe and be blessed
    Frank
    No, thank you. I'm not trying to stifle discussion or debate, but there sometimes comes a point when a shot across the bow is needed to get attention and put things back on the proper course.

    Talk (nicely) among yourselves now.

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    #36
    Wayne,
    Reckon Paul was right, since he had seen it first hand, that at times we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities ........... against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places. Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand. Amen and Amen.

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