200 efi not reaching WOT

[Crappieguy84]

Engine SN is OG350446

Issue at hand is not able to turn more than about 5,000 rpm under load.
115-120 psi on all cylinders
Injectors flowed and calibrated by Brucato FIS
TDR Reeds
pulse pump rebuilt
Cleaned and replaced check valve in VST
all new fuel lines
New filter
ECU just rebuilt by Simons
Timing advance and idle stab removed
idle timing is 4 atdc
max timing is 25 btdc
Both of these are set with highest advanced cylinder (number 2)
Spark seemed strong and consistent on all cylinders when setting timing
TPS set to spec
verified WOT ability by checking throttle linkage and butterflies

What checks should I be doing to trouble shoot this issue?
I’ve tried a smaller prop and it didn’t seem to make a difference in RPM.
RPMs are being verified by handheld tach.

This is a new to me boat so I can not confirm any history before my ownership.

[STLBASS]

Make sure your lower unit is good!! Check your fuel pressure as well. Could have high fuel pressure and running pig rich. Run wot and pull kill switch. check your plugs or piston tops if possible. A good place to start anyway

[JOE54]

sensors tested, air, map, head temp

[Crappieguy84]

Joe, I will check sensors and report back.

[Crappieguy84]

sensors tested, air, map, head temp

Checked the intake air and head temp sensors, both checked good, slow to change but within spec.
I also checked the vacuum line going from the intake to the ECU for the MAP sensor, it was clean.

Is there a way to check the function of the MAP sensor? I am making the assumption that this is good since the ECU just came back from Simons.

[lpugh]

What Boat, prop and gear ratio do you have
GPS speed at wot
How much trim used (rooster tail height as well)
what is the prop to pad measurement
Has the combination you have now ever done better

[Crappieguy84]

What Boat, prop and gear ratio do you have
GPS speed at wot
How much trim used (rooster tail height as well)
what is the prop to pad measurement
Has the combination you have now ever done better

Charger 195
GPS speed is 53 or so with 5000 rpm
trimmed with a rooster tail just below motor height or less
PTP is 2.75” below
This is a new to me boat, I have never seen it better.

[Crappieguy84]

I double checked a few things today, ran some ignition tests with a meter. Link and sync is good, TPS is .245, ohmed out the coils and switch boxes.

Out of curiosity I checked the plugs, they seem a bit “wet” to me. All are pretty consistent.
2B173A58-8573-4F6D-A887-D38CF9ADB1C5.jpeg

[JOE54]

what prop,do look rich

[Crappieguy84]

what prop,do look rich

Joe, this is a tempest 25p.
I tried a 24P 4 blade and it didn’t change the RPMs much, just gave me a bit more lift.

what do you think could be causing a rich situation? It makes sense that I’d it’s rich it won’t pull enough RPMs.

[lpugh]

^^^^^^ all of the above and:
If you have not done so already, I would recheck the accuracy of the TDC mark being used just to be sure,
Also check for any loose sound deadeners in the cowl or a restriction in the cowl intake

[Crappieguy84]

^^^^^^ all of the above and:
If you have not done so already, I would recheck the accuracy of the TDC mark being used just to be sure,
Also check for any loose sound deadeners in the cowl or a restriction in the cowl intake

Leon,
Verified the .462 mark, and made accurate timing marks for all cylinders on the flywheel.
I will verify no obstructions in the cowling.

any other ideas that would cause this to not hit the higher RPM?

[JOE54]

you know anyone with 200 efi could borrow ecu for a test, checked screen in regulator for obstruction causeing higher fuel psi

[Crappieguy84]

you know anyone with 200 efi could borrow ecu for a test, checked screen in regulator for obstruction causeing higher fuel psi

Joe, no I don’t know anyone that would loan out and ECU. Unless anyone here is in MO, I’m willing to come to them or cover shipping and even pay a small fee to rent it.
I had sent my ECU to get rebuilt by Simons, I’m taking their word for it that all is good...

I’ll pull the regulator to check for debris.

[JOE54]

and I know you have checked to see if tuner has fallen off ??????? hmmmmmm

[Crappieguy84]

and I know you have checked to see if tuner has fallen off ??????? hmmmmmm

Joe, I’ll check that later today. That never crossed my mind.
more details to come.

[JOE54]

aren't you glad it did mine

[Crappieguy84]

I pulled the LU off, all looks good and tight, just very carboned up and wet.
Also checked the fuel regulator screen for debris, it was clean. Pulled fuel lines from pulse pump to separator and back to VST. These were clean and in good shape. A bit hard but not brittle. Replaced those since I was that deep.
drained the VST, no water, just a few pieces of debris, not much at all.

I ordered a DVA to complete the ignition tests I couldn’t do with a straight meter, but the meter tests I did checked good.

Any other checks I should be doing?

[lpugh]

I think from reading your post you will probably know what I am leading to and I doubt there is a problem in this area, but just in case how much difference is there in the timing between # 1 and the one you are using, The fact you even new about most advanced makes me think you have got this down.

How the hole shot on this boat, any chance it has water saturated flotation? Usually this will kill the bottom end as well
Check the hull with a strait edge for hooks and rockers
Is there anything such as a transducer on the pad that could disturb smooth water flow to the lower unit
Make sure the fuel pressure does not start falling off at high demand such as WOT
May be check with Eric that it was reflashed with the correct software, mistakes and mis understandings do happen sometimes

use a borescope camera to check for turned sleeves

[Crappieguy84]

I think from reading your post you will probably know what I am leading to and I doubt there is a problem in this area, but just in case how much difference is there in the timing between # 1 and the one you are using, The fact you even new about most advanced makes me think you have got this down.

How the hole shot on this boat, any chance it has water saturated flotation? Usually this will kill the bottom end as well
Check the hull with a strait edge for hooks and rockers
Is there anything such as a transducer on the pad that could disturb smooth water flow to the lower unit
Make sure the fuel pressure does not start falling off at high demand such as WOT
May be check with Eric that it was reflashed with the correct software, mistakes and mis understandings do happen sometimes

use a borescope camera to check for turned sleeves

Leon, timing from 1 was 23*, highest cylinder was #2 @25* with others inside that variance.
Hole shot isn’t bad, 5 seconds or less with the Tempest 25P, when I put my 4 blade 24P I have to feather the throttle or I’ll blow out at the tipping point.
Mid range throttle is good, its just not pulling past the 5K rpm mark.
The hull seems good, I ran a borescope through everything I could and didn’t not notice any issues. It sits in the water about like every other Charger 195 from that time frame.
I have my ‘ducer mounted to my jack plate well above the pad. There doesn’t seem to be any abnormal spray coming from the back like something is dragging.

I called Simons 2 weeks ago and really wasn’t too impressed with them. The only thing I could get out of them was there was a bad driver and all drivers were replaced, ECU was flashed to 200 EFI specs.
I am working to locate someone to loan me a known good ECU, easier said than done.
I am tempted to just buy a used one but don’t want to inherit someone else’s problem.

I’ll check all cylinders with a borescope and report back.
I’m still puzzled with what seems to be a rich fuel situation on all cylinders.