Onboard charger shock issue

[Ajojo]

I have a Tracker PT 190 with a NOCO 3 bank onboard charger. This charges 2 12v batteries in a 24V system for the trolling motor, and a 12v cranking battery. I have noticed that when the charger is plugged in, I get a tingling sensation when I touch any metal parts on the boat. I don't really feel it when I touch the aluminum hull itself. It's only noticeable when touching parts of the motor or screws and such. I don't feel it when the charger is unplugged. Has anyone ever had this situation? What can I check to figure out whats wrong?

[CatFan]

How far is the boat from your house? Long extension cord or in a detached building? Does it happen other places, or just at home?

[Ajojo]

How far is the boat from your house? Long extension cord or in a detached building? Does it happen other places, or just at home?

I haven't tried it anywhere else but at home. I have tried a garage outlet and another outdoor outlet so far. The extension cord is 16 Gauge /50 feet. I did try a different cord as well.

[CatFan]

Do you have a volt meter?

[Ajojo]

Do you have a volt meter?

Yes. While the charger is plugged in, I am measuring the black lead to ground from another cord from the same outlet and the red lead to the metal parts of the boat. I am reading 86 volts AC, which seems really high. Am I doing this correctly?

[CatFan]

86V sounds like a voltage leak and bad ground. Is this plugged into a GFCI? Probably best to do a methodical test to start so we don’t assume anything:

Take the cord you are using and measure voltages: Hot to ground (should be 120). Hot to neutral (should be 120) and Neutral to ground (should be 0). That will verify your outlet and cord are good.

Then put in a splitter of some kind at the boat so you have a spare outlet and measure ground on the cord to boat hull, lower unit and charger case. Should all be 0, Measure hot to those same points. Should all be 120V.

If that all checks out, drive a foot long metal stake into the ground near the boat, dump a bucket of water on it and measure from ground on the cord to the stake. You want the reading to be 0, but there is nothing to make it 0. If you get a reading here, that’s probably what you are feeling.

[Ajojo]

I just did all the above except for driving the stake because it didn't check out ok. The cord checked out ok, but now I'm reading 57 volts from cord outlet to metal parts on boat. The aluminum hull itself is minimal. The charger case is plastic.

[CatFan]

I just did all the above except for driving the stake because it didn't check out ok. The cord checked out ok, but now I'm reading 57 volts from cord outlet to metal parts on boat. The aluminum hull itself is minimal. The charger case is plastic.

Your charger may have an isolation issue from AC ground to the battery negative. It could also be an induced voltage that is a result of the charger inductively coupling power to the metal. Maybe measure from hot to the negative post of the cranking battery.

[Rip Bass]

Catfan,that has to be an issue with his charger. There should never be any AC voltage going to any part of his boat,other than the charger. He will get a common ground to the hull due to contact between the engine and hull but it should only show a ground for 12v dc. I know you know all this,just making a point. The only thing that can cause AC to ground to the boat is the charger. You agree? And to Ajojo,you need a bigger extension cord,preferably a #12.

[Ajojo]

Your charger may have an isolation issue from AC ground to the battery negative. It could also be an induced voltage that is a result of the charger inductively coupling power to the metal. Maybe measure from hot to the negative post of the cranking battery.

It is a new boat, so I was hoping to rule out the charger. Measuring from hot on the cord to negative of cranking battery is 86 volts.

Just to see what would happen, I unhooked all wiring to cranking battery. From cord ground to boat metal it was down to about 12v AC.

It makes sense what Rip Bass is saying, that it has to be the charger.

[CatFan]

No doubt it’s the charger. IIRC, there was another member with a charger isolation issue not too long ago.

[wmitch2]

No doubt it’s the charger. IIRC, there was another member with a charger isolation issue not too long ago.

CatFan, is there anywhere in the electrical system that the Ground from the battery is connected to the hull ? Would this cause what he is feeling ?

[CatFan]

CatFan, is there anywhere in the electrical system that the Ground from the battery is connected to the hull ? Would this cause what he is feeling ?

It is connected to the outboard body. There is no intentional connection to the hull, though they usually end up connected just because of proximity and all of the fittings and cables. I believe the issue is that the hot from the charger power cord is not isolated from the output of the charger.

[Rip Bass]

Ajojo,I would try to document all of this for warranty purposes,although it’s under warranty so it might not matter. None of your electronics from the engine to the graphs and pumps are going to like 86v AC.

[Ajojo]

I have an appointment with the dealer next week. I also have another issue with the transom flexing. I had another post about that. Will keep you posted.

[RdRngR]

No doubt it’s the charger. IIRC, there was another member with a charger isolation issue not too long ago.

Yes, I had this exact problem except Minn Kota charger. My 2011 Ranger Z520 (Dual Pro charger) didn't have it. When I got my 2016 Z50C (Minn Kota charger) I discovered that if I touch anything metal, engine, jack plate, etc. I got a "tingle" if I was barefoot in the garage, no tingle with flip flops or shoes on. The 2016 was in the same garage, using the same extension cord plugged into the same GFI outlet as the 2011 (which I had for 5 years) I know the 2011 did not do this.

I swapped extension cords, used different outlets (even the GFI in the kitchen) no change, no matter what I tried still got that tingle when touching metal. Thought it had to be the charger so went to my dealer. There we all stood, no shoes or socks on, charger plugged in and all touching metal but no tingle, I could not believe it, no fault found. They did give me a brand new Minn Kota charger (I watched the installation) no tingle after with that one, we tried again, no shoes and touching metal, all good.

Got home, plugged it in and same thing. I called Minn Kota and they said they never heard of it before and given the charger was replaced and still had the same issue, had to be something with house electrical system (5 year old house). I had the electrician come and he checked but said nothing was wrong. He took his shoes off and felt the tingle so he experienced the problem but said it had to be something on the boat.

Interestingly, if if moved the boat out of the garage on to the driveway, no tingle (same cord and outlet). I gave up and just lived with it.

Traded that 2016 in on my new 2019 Z520C (Dual Pro charger) same extension cord, same GFI outlet no more tingle.

Replacing the Minn Kota charger definitely did not fix the issue for me.

Good luck

[Ajojo]

Updating this post. The dealer replaced the charger. Got home and plugged it in hoping for the best. Still getting the tingling. Didn't feel it when I had shoes on though. I guess I'll have to live with it.

[billnorman1]

You can feel a tingle especially if you or the boat is wet because wetness bypasses your skin which partially protects you. As little as 2 or 3 volts will do it. I'd say check out all your cords and outlets feeding the charger for a weak ground (white wire). Maybe it's loose and the safety ground is carring some load.

If your name is Chris Matthews it's understandable.

[Rick H]

Updating this post. The dealer replaced the charger. Got home and plugged it in hoping for the best. Still getting the tingling. Didn't feel it when I had shoes on though. I guess I'll have to live with it.

Something is wrong! You or someone else may not live with it. (((Tingling))) There's is your sign!

[1GThompson]

I wouldn’t live with it. I’d try disconnecting one charging bank at a time from the batteries, plug the charger in, and see if and when it goes away. That will tell you if the problem is on the charging side and what bank has the problem. If it’s still there, I would remove the charger completely and inspect all of the cords, especially the AC cord. It could have been damaged on installation. I know you said the charger was replaced, but it could have improperly installed twice. I’ve seen crazier things. Then with the charger removed and isolated from the boat I would wire one bank at a time back into the batteries to see if and/or when the problem reappears.