Baystar hydraulic steering trouble shooting

[dcalvert]

My 19' Flats/Bay boat with DF 140 HP Suzuki and Baystar Hyd. steering is giving me fits. The rig is 2013 and in great shape but. It started last spring when i noticed a small leak at the seal on the top of the help steering pump. Simple enough I ordered a seal from seastar and was a simple fix. No other leaks or steering issues. I launched a few week ago and steering was bad. Motor would not respond well and when power is applied motor turns to port. So back on the trailer I went. Went through the bleed process again, no air and full.

I have bleed the system 3 times to per the manufacturers recommendations(3 times) . Proper sea star hydraulic fluid ect. Inspected for leaks at all connections to helm pump and steering ram with no sign of leaks.

When I manually push the motor I can move it the entire travel in port and starboard directions. Is this correct?
My thought is that the Helm pump is bad but I hate to throw down $300 plus to test.

Is there any other test I could do myself to confirm this?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Dcalvert

[toddgot5fish]

you could pull the lines off the cylinder and block them off(not sure what to block them off with). if the motor then moves, you have a bad cylinder. if it doesn't move, bad helm... my .02 worth

[billnorman1]

If it isn't a bad cylinder or pump (helm) you have air in the system. Are you blocking the motor from turning as you bleed it? What you describes is air, just where it is is beyond me. UNLESS the actuator is bleeding the fluid back into the helm. If that's the case, you screwed the helm up when you fixed it.
Toddgot5fish sounds pretty savvy.

[dcalvert]

I am sure there no air in the system. The bleed process calls for you to bleed with the system hard against the port and starboard respectively so the answer to your question on blocking is yes. Don't think changing the seal on the helm shaft goofed it up as it is quite simple to do. I so feel the actuator is bleeding back into the helm but want figure out how to confirm this prior to just changing parts out.

[dcalvert]

Not sure what your describing. Are you saying that with lines off and blocked the motor should not move when i manually push it from stop to stop?

Thank you

[billnorman1]

IF you have both sides of the steering cylinder full of fluid with no air in there, and block off the feed hose ports, you must not be able to turn the motor or it is bypassing internally. This is almost impossible.
Fill the helm. Get a quart (empty) bottle of steering fluid, cut the bottom off, hang it upside down with a small (maybe 1/4") clear vinyl tubing connected to the pointed nozzle on the steering fluid bottle and the bleeder, and open the bleeder. Put a couple ounces of steering fluid in the upside down bottle. Turn the helm from side to side slowly until there are no more bubbles in the line. Let the motor turn if you wish. Tighten the bleeder, do the other side.
If that doesn't fix it you got real trouble OR you don't have the helm full.

[dcalvert]

I used this bubble purge OST system to bleed. It can be viewed here.

Did it 3 time to be sure no more air. Helm is full! Thinking the Helm pump or check valves in it are bad. I wold replace it with new but I am trying to confirm this.
Not trying to be cheap just don't want to replace Helm and find out it the actuator.
Thank you again for your suggestions. Boat only has 70 hour on it and had it new. fresh water only.
dcalvert

[billnorman1]

Well if it works for him that's cool. I described the system I devised and I successfully bleed systems by myself. Before I would buy a new helm or actuator I'd try a lot of different things.
Once that bolt and casting rust through that boat owner is in for a one way excursion.

[lpugh]

IF you have both sides of the steering cylinder full of fluid with no air in there, and block off the feed hose ports, you must not be able to turn the motor or it is bypassing internally. This is almost impossible.
Fill the helm. Get a quart (empty) bottle of steering fluid, cut the bottom off, hang it upside down with a small (maybe 1/4") clear vinyl tubing connected to the pointed nozzle on the steering fluid bottle and the bleeder, and open the bleeder. Put a couple ounces of steering fluid in the upside down bottle. Turn the helm from side to side slowly until there are no more bubbles in the line. Let the motor turn if you wish. Tighten the bleeder, do the other side.
If that doesn't fix it you got real trouble OR you don't have the helm full.

Your method is far faster to bleed and will get all the air out

[dcalvert]

I would also add that that after I emailed the owner of OutBoard specialty tool, that he called me and spent 1/2 hour helping me troubleshoot my problem with the My BayStar Hydraulic steering. Very knowledgeable marine mechanic. This was very helpful, and a wealth of information.

dcalvert

[billnorman1]

I would also add that that after I emailed the owner of OutBoard specialty tool, that he called me and spent 1/2 hour helping me troubleshoot my problem with the My BayStar Hydraulic steering. Very knowledgeable marine mechanic. This was very helpful, and a wealth of information.

dcalvert

Well, it's been 3 days, did you find anything out by applying his advice? We all like to absorb anything that helps troubleshoot or maintain hydraulic systems and keep on safely boating.

[dcalvert]

I narrowed it down to the helm pump. It not un-heard of failure on the BayStar line. New one on my bench but, I am going to get a chance to install it until 2nd or third week of Nov.
Owner of OutBoard specialty tool was very helpful.

dcalvert